ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9

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Post by CienaRee on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 11:02 am

@Jakku wrote:
@vaderito wrote:
@Jakku wrote:Daisy has expressed apprehension that fans will still like her character after VIII, so we pretty much know that Rey isn't going to be all sweetness and light.  
@Jakku

It may not be about sweetness and light. She won't hook up with Finn so some fans will be up in arms. She may be confirmed as Absolutely, 100% NOT Related to Skywalkers and Solo so that may have some fans up in arms too. But they aren't GA so who cares. GA will like it and they are everything.
@vaderito

True, and possibly Rey's allegiances will change during the course of the film, towards not being hostile towards Kylo. Given that many people have projected childlike purity onto her character, that may be uncomfortable for many.
@Jakku@vaderito 

Actually I'm not sure Rey not hooking up with Finn or not being a Reywalker would make Daisy nervious about the reception of her character.She had no problem saying Rey's parentage isn't a big deal/debunking Rey Solo or saying Finn and Rey are great friends.
I think it could be something about her character's personality or allegiance changing because she said shew as aware why Rey was so loved by the fandom.It could even have something to do woth ehr feleings for Kylo changing.

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Post by vaderito on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 11:06 am

@CienaRee Well, everyone (except us tee-hee) expect her to become Luke's drone so whatever Luke says is the law. I think what will happen is that young people will not put up with Jedi code. So it'll be, like, how dare she side with Kylo against Luke's wisdom? Again, only something for Internet minority to whine about.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 11:17 am

@Jakku wrote:
@vaderito wrote:
@Jakku wrote:Daisy has expressed apprehension that fans will still like her character after VIII, so we pretty much know that Rey isn't going to be all sweetness and light.  
@Jakku

It may not be about sweetness and light. She won't hook up with Finn so some fans will be up in arms. She may be confirmed as Absolutely, 100% NOT Related to Skywalkers and Solo so that may have some fans up in arms too. But they aren't GA so who cares. GA will like it and they are everything.
@vaderito

I find that rather sad - a young woman with a kind heart starts seeing her enemy as human after learning something tragic about his background and people don't like her for it.
My favourite thing about Rey - she may be tough but she still has a heart. Too many 'strong female characters' are cold and hard.

True, and possibly Rey's allegiances will change during the course of the film, towards not being hostile towards Kylo. Given that many people have projected childlike purity onto her character, that may be uncomfortable for many.
@Jakku

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Post by snufkin on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 11:44 am

@vaderito wrote:@motherofpearl1 Rey won't become a villain but I can see them work together and his becoming anti hero. he'll never be a hero and SW doesn't need more, but it needs anti heroes and I'm sorry but Poe doesn't cut it. I don't even know why some fans think he's a Han figure but he's already good shiny with unblemished reputation, that's not an anti hero.
@vaderito

There's a comment in the documentary from Kasdan about Poe being like Han, which is either a misdirection or just a generalization that he's a really good pilot and a cocky smart a** when he's in trouble. Otherwise he's a company man, through and through. If anything, Finn might be the closest because he goes from being completely self interested to putting himself in danger to save his friend.

Otherwise, it sounds like if she's going to be spending a lot of time with Mr. Mysterious, Conflicted Big Bad that's going to change the both of them. Or at least the actual relationship that the writers intended all along will be revealed, likely that he'll become more of an anti-hero, disappointing both the fanboys who've been saying he's supposed be Vader 2.0 and the purity police who keep insisting that she's a "role model" and should "be like Ripley in Alien" without a man around.
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Post by vaderito on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 11:57 am

@snufkin wrote:

There's a comment in the documentary from Kasdan about Poe being like Han, which is either a misdirection or just a generalization that he's a really good pilot and a cocky smart a** when he's in trouble. Otherwise he's a company man, through and through. If anything, Finn might be the closest because he goes from being completely self interested to putting himself in danger to save his friend.

Otherwise, it sounds like if she's going to be spending a lot of time with Mr. Mysterious, Conflicted Big Bad that's going to change the both of them. Or at least the actual relationship that the writers intended all along will be revealed, likely that he'll become more of an anti-hero, disappointing both the fanboys who've been saying he's supposed be Vader 2.0 and the purity police who keep insisting that she's a "role model" and should "be like Ripley in Alien" without a man around.
@snufkin

Ripley in Alien had a man around

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Post by creepi0 on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 11:59 am

The way why Rey portrayed as childlike/purity kinda like Anakin in prequel make me think maybe the twist in this trilogy is Rey turned to the darkside. There seem some foreshadowing moment especially in the saberlock scene at the cliff side when her eye look like reptile eye and she always attack with angry faces. Maybe that the reason why they will reveal Rey parentage in episode 9 because i think what happen to her parents will be strong motivation for her to turned heel. But since episode 8 haven't released yet im not realy sure, i mean not all good story has twist but they definitely have a surprise moment.
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Post by snufkin on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 12:02 pm

@vaderito - So they basically want Rey to be a single cat lady! Kind of like how they're hoping that she spends the rest of the trilogy with a cute little robot or Chewie instead of getting an inappropriate boyfriend (hint, not Finn).

And personally, I hope the whole DS angle for Rey is that either it has something to do with her background on Jakku. Or just finally being away from there and not being able to stay in denial about the trauma thanks to being an orphan in Unkar Plutt's workhouse (seriously, that character waddled straight in from Dickens), always being kept on the edge of starvation, being a child laborer in a dangerous environment, being an attractive young woman in a dangerous environment, loneliness/isolation, etc. Hopefully Luke hasn't gone full crazy, but it'd be interesting to see between the three of them stuck together in a dangerous, isolated environment, whether it's uncle or nephew who reaches out to her the most. My money's on the latter, including some more "feeling the Force" but probably also some genuine empathy.


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Post by motherofpearl1 on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 12:10 pm

I'm a single cat lady, but I really want Rey and Kylo to be a couple! cat
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Post by Guest on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 12:35 pm

@creepi0 wrote:The way why Rey portrayed as childlike/purity kinda like Anakin in prequel make me think maybe the twist in this trilogy is Rey turned to the darkside. There seem some foreshadowing moment especially in the saberlock scene at the cliff side when her eye look like reptile eye and she always attack with angry faces. Maybe that the reason why they will reveal Rey parentage in episode 9 because i think what happen to her parents will be strong motivation for her to turned heel. But since episode 8 haven't released yet im not realy sure, i mean not all good story has twist but they definitely have a surprise moment.
@creepi0

Imagine Rey attacking with this face:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_o509jj1z5a1v7o9alo2_500

Kylo would run far away and never return. No need for parts VIII and IX.Razz

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Post by IoJovi on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 12:42 pm

WhatGirl wrote:
@creepi0 wrote:The way why Rey portrayed as childlike/purity kinda like Anakin in prequel make me think maybe the twist in this trilogy is Rey turned to the darkside. There seem some foreshadowing moment especially in the saberlock scene at the cliff side when her eye look like reptile eye and she always attack with angry faces. Maybe that the reason why they will reveal Rey parentage in episode 9 because i think what happen to her parents will be strong motivation for her to turned heel. But since episode 8 haven't released yet im not realy sure, i mean not all good story has twist but they definitely have a surprise moment.
@creepi0

Imagine Rey attacking with this face:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_o509jj1z5a1v7o9alo2_500

Kylo would run far away and never return. No need for parts VIII and IX.Razz
@WhatGirl

I think if they are going the way of a love story between Rey and Kylo, it has to inevitable that she would be tempted by the dark. How else is she going to understand him or what made him fall in the first place? I don't see her becoming a full fledged villain murdering folks willy nilly that stand in her way, but things she thought were true (such as her parents coming back for her) are going to be shattered, much in the same way Kylo Ren's current beliefs will be shattered.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 12:51 pm

I think Kylo is already partly there; Snoke's promise that Han's death would bring him peace was a lie and he realises that.
Or...Snoke himself misunderstood just how much of Ben Solo still lives inside Kylo.
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Post by ISeeAnIsland on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 12:52 pm

@IoJovi wrote:
WhatGirl wrote:
@creepi0 wrote:The way why Rey portrayed as childlike/purity kinda like Anakin in prequel make me think maybe the twist in this trilogy is Rey turned to the darkside. There seem some foreshadowing moment especially in the saberlock scene at the cliff side when her eye look like reptile eye and she always attack with angry faces. Maybe that the reason why they will reveal Rey parentage in episode 9 because i think what happen to her parents will be strong motivation for her to turned heel. But since episode 8 haven't released yet im not realy sure, i mean not all good story has twist but they definitely have a surprise moment.
@creepi0

Imagine Rey attacking with this face:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_o509jj1z5a1v7o9alo2_500

Kylo would run far away and never return. No need for parts VIII and IX.Razz
@WhatGirl

I think if they are going the way of a love story between Rey and Kylo, it has to inevitable that she would be tempted by the dark. How else is she going to understand him or what made him fall in the first place? I don't see her becoming a full fledged villain murdering folks willy nilly that stand in her way, but things she thought were true (such as her parents coming back for her) are going to be shattered, much in the same way Kylo Ren's current beliefs will be shattered.
@IoJovi

Right. She is "going to be tempted", but I suspect that beyond the obvious walking temptation of Kylo, the "dark side" temptation will manifest itself as rage and other uncontrolled emotions. I wouldn't be surprised if we see her using some traditional dark side Force powers--e.g., she'll become enraged and start to choke someone or something. But I don't think we'll see her go full-dark. And as you are saying, the end result will be that she and Kylo will be able to understand each other incredibly well.
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Post by Guest on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 12:56 pm

@IoJovi wrote:I think if they are going the way of a love story between Rey and Kylo, it has to inevitable that she would be tempted by the dark. How else is she going to understand him or what made him fall in the first place? I don't see her becoming a full fledged villain murdering folks willy nilly that stand in her way, but things she thought were true (such as her parents coming back for her) are going to be shattered, much in the same way Kylo Ren's current beliefs will be shattered.

@IoJovi Yes I definitely think this is going to happen. We've already seen Kylo being seduced and drawn to Rey's "light", so who's to say Rey won't be drawn by Kylo's "darkness" (although you could argue that she already has been in the snow duel in TFA). An idea struck me while I was reading a meta on Three Outlaw Samurai by @nonesuch, such as the line "Almost everyone in the film betrays someone - you have a daughter defying her father by helping the man who kidnapped her." I don't think Rey will have the same father/daughter relationship with Luke as she did with Han, but I still think he will be some sort of authority/teacher figure for her. According to the spoilers, Rey doesn't want to kill Kylo, so maybe over the course of the movie she becomes sympathetic to Kylo and helps him for whatever reason. If the spoilers are true, she's already defying Luke's orders to kill him. Of course I'm just speculating here.

Nonesuch's meta: http://starwarsnonsense.tumblr.com/post/148253497729/three-outlaw-samurai-or-some-predictions-on


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Post by CienaRee on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 1:00 pm

@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
WhatGirl wrote:
@creepi0 wrote:The way why Rey portrayed as childlike/purity kinda like Anakin in prequel make me think maybe the twist in this trilogy is Rey turned to the darkside. There seem some foreshadowing moment especially in the saberlock scene at the cliff side when her eye look like reptile eye and she always attack with angry faces. Maybe that the reason why they will reveal Rey parentage in episode 9 because i think what happen to her parents will be strong motivation for her to turned heel. But since episode 8 haven't released yet im not realy sure, i mean not all good story has twist but they definitely have a surprise moment.
@creepi0

Imagine Rey attacking with this face:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_o509jj1z5a1v7o9alo2_500

Kylo would run far away and never return. No need for parts VIII and IX.Razz
@WhatGirl

I think if they are going the way of a love story between Rey and Kylo, it has to inevitable that she would be tempted by the dark.  How else is she going to understand him or what made him fall in the first place?  I don't see her becoming a full fledged villain murdering folks willy nilly that stand in her way, but things she thought were true (such as her parents coming back for her) are going to be shattered, much in the same way Kylo Ren's current beliefs will be shattered.
 
@IoJovi

Right. She is "going to be tempted", but I suspect that beyond the obvious walking temptation of Kylo, the "dark side" temptation will manifest itself as rage and other uncontrolled emotions. I wouldn't be surprised if we see her using some traditional dark side Force powers--e.g., she'll become enraged and start to choke someone or something. But I don't think we'll see her go full-dark. And as you are saying, the end result will be that she and Kylo will be able to understand each other incredibly well.
@ISeeAnIsland

Yeah,for me Rey going dark doesn't necessarily means murdering everyone standing in her way but getting more bitter and delusional.It would be a good contrast to how she started the move.In ''Lost Stars''we kind of have something similair happening with the main characters.Ciena Ree at the beggining of the story is optimistic and naive while Thane Kyrell is tye cynical ine(who's suffered abuse from his family)but as the storyline progresses Ciena's the one who ends up being dellusioned and bitter by the Empire after havung spend years survig it to the point where she tries to kill herself and Thane's the one who becomes more optimistic and cheerful after he joins the Rebellion.I can see something like that happening with Kylo and Rey.

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Post by vaderito on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 1:03 pm

@creepi0 wrote:The way why Rey portrayed as childlike/purity kinda like Anakin in prequel make me think maybe the twist in this trilogy is Rey turned to the darkside. There seem some foreshadowing moment especially in the saberlock scene at the cliff side when her eye look like reptile eye and she always attack with angry faces. Maybe that the reason why they will reveal Rey parentage in episode 9 because i think what happen to her parents will be strong motivation for her to turned heel. But since episode 8 haven't released yet im not realy sure, i mean not all good story has twist but they definitely have a surprise moment.
@creepi0

Good catch!

Reptile Eye Rey

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_inline_o55ungjJDp1qjtxsg_1280
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Post by nonesuch on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 2:07 pm

AppleCrumble122 wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:I think if they are going the way of a love story between Rey and Kylo, it has to inevitable that she would be tempted by the dark. How else is she going to understand him or what made him fall in the first place? I don't see her becoming a full fledged villain murdering folks willy nilly that stand in her way, but things she thought were true (such as her parents coming back for her) are going to be shattered, much in the same way Kylo Ren's current beliefs will be shattered.

@IoJovi Yes I definitely think this is going to happen. We've already seen Kylo being seduced and drawn to Rey's "light", so who's to say Rey won't be drawn by Kylo's "darkness" (although you could argue that she already has been in the snow duel in TFA). An idea struck me while I was reading a meta on Three Outlaw Samurai by @nonesuch, such as the line "Almost everyone in the film betrays someone - you have a daughter defying her father by helping the man who kidnapped her." I don't think Rey will have the same father/daughter relationship with Luke as she did with Han, but I still think he will be some sort of authority/teacher figure for her. According to the spoilers, Rey doesn't want to kill Kylo, so maybe over the course of the movie she becomes sympathetic to Kylo and helps him for whatever reason. If the spoilers are true, she's already defying Luke's orders to kill him. Of course I'm just speculating here.

Nonesuch's meta: http://starwarsnonsense.tumblr.com/post/148253497729/three-outlaw-samurai-or-some-predictions-on

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I actually plan on writing a whole separate meta on Aya, since the journey she undergoes and the shifts in perception she demonstrates are very interesting, especially from a Reylo perspective. She starts off as a kidnap victim, filled with hate, scorn and disgust for her kidnappers, who include the wandering samurai Shiba (who winds up involved more because of his curiosity rather than any obligation). When Shiba steps in to defend her from another one of her kidnappers (who comes close to hurting her, driven mad by distress after seeing his own daughter tortured) and even offers to take the punishment for the others who kidnapped her in the first place, her view of him changes. She begins to recognise his inner nobility and admires his principles and bravery. This admiration grows into something like love, and she actually risks her life to help him escape her father's guards. She is then only seen again at the end, when she defends her father (who is a corrupt, greedy magistrate) from Shiba's sword. The caps below basically illustrate the main beats of her development:

Imperious disdain:
ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Vlcsnap-error218_zpsyyugttug

Confused in the face of his principles (when he offers to be punished instead of the peasants who kidnapped her):
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Profound admiration and affection when faced with separation from him:
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Ultimate loyalty to her father (when Shiba threatens to kill her if she won't move):
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ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Vlcsnap-error798_zps6pwmcvsz

Three Outlaw Samurai has some very dated gender politics (in large part because of its setting), but I could definitely see aspects of the character's journey feeding into Rey's, especially in terms of the changing perspective on the world and the loyalty to the 'father' (who, of course, wouldn't literally be Rey's father in VIII), despite the awful things he has done. I could see Kylo revealing Luke to be something other than the noble teacher she believed him to be, and Rey's loyalty to him being severely challenged. I'll write more on this when I get a chance.
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Post by Guest on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 2:13 pm

@nonesuch I look forward to it! Smile

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Post by Guest on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 5:33 pm

That Stormtrooper guy's "spoilers" are getting some traction. I've seen a few sites use that blog as a source for "Exclusive Ep VIII spoilers". The KMT stuff is certainly doing the rounds. What I find most laughable is the insistence of that particular scooper that there's absolutely no chemistry between John Boyega and Kelly Marie Tran on screen when John Boyega himself said that KMT taught him a lot about chemistry. Why would JB and Rian Johnson be gushing about KMT if she's getting next to no screen time and has no chemistry (romantic or not) with her co-stars?!

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Post by Kessel on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 5:40 pm

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:That Stormtrooper guy's "spoilers" are getting some traction. I've seen a few sites use that blog as a source for "Exclusive Ep VIII spoilers". The KMT stuff is certainly doing the rounds. What I find most laughable is the insistence of that particular scooper that there's absolutely no chemistry between John Boyega and Kelly Marie Tran on screen when John Boyega himself said that KMT taught him a lot about chemistry. Why would JB and Rian Johnson be gushing about KMT if she's getting next to no screen time and has no chemistry (romantic or not) with her co-stars?!
@Mrs Ben Solo

No chemistry? Lol.  Didn't KMT and JB specifically have chemistry tests together? I bet Rian and the casting directors, etc. must disagree with Trooper "scooper" and his "source" on that one...

That "scooper's" agenda is really crystal clear. I think we ALL see him...
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Post by Xylo Ren on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 5:44 pm

No chemistry?

Sounds like a FinnRey's opinion...

Which spoilers were those again?
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Post by Guest on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 5:54 pm

@Xylo Ren wrote:No chemistry?

Sounds like a FinnRey's opinion...

Which spoilers were those again?
@Xylo Ren

This is the link that just popped up on my Twitter timeline http://comicbook.com/2016/08/02/star-wars-episode-8-spoilers-kelly-marie-trans-character-details/ but I've seen a few of these sites using that blog as a spoiler source.

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Post by ISeeAnIsland on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 6:15 pm

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:That Stormtrooper guy's "spoilers" are getting some traction. I've seen a few sites use that blog as a source for "Exclusive Ep VIII spoilers". The KMT stuff is certainly doing the rounds. What I find most laughable is the insistence of that particular scooper that there's absolutely no chemistry between John Boyega and Kelly Marie Tran on screen when John Boyega himself said that KMT taught him a lot about chemistry. Why would JB and Rian Johnson be gushing about KMT if she's getting next to no screen time and has no chemistry (romantic or not) with her co-stars?!
@Mrs Ben Solo

I've seen that too, in a few places. What's funny is that I did have a tiny bit of concern about him until he posted the KMT thing. That was the last straw for me, as far as him having any credibility. The KMT post just goes against everything that we've been hearing (and seeing, if you count Space Horse Chase).
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Post by Rimfaxe96 on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 6:20 pm

WhatGirl wrote:Imagine Rey attacking with this face:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_o509jj1z5a1v7o9alo2_500

Kylo would run far away and never return. No need for parts VIII and IX.Razz
@WhatGirl

Especially if she's attacking with an axe.

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Christian_bale_american_psycho_patrick_bateman_axe_10989289_RE_PwnzElite_has_declared_war_on_Grammar_Nazis-s400x300-173837

But to be fair, Ren's anger-face is kinda scary too:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_ob6ckj9NuH1vahid5o1_540
ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_ob6ckj9NuH1vahid5o2_540
ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_ob6ckj9NuH1vahid5o3_540
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Post by vaderito on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 8:59 pm

LOL, guys, there's spoiler drought so some sites will use anything. It's called slow news day. 

"No chemsitry" still can't explain space horse snuggling. Lets hear about that, spoiler boy.
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Post by IoJovi on Tue 02 Aug 2016, 9:12 pm

@Rimfaxe96 wrote:
WhatGirl wrote:Imagine Rey attacking with this face:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_o509jj1z5a1v7o9alo2_500

Kylo would run far away and never return. No need for parts VIII and IX.Razz
@WhatGirl

Especially if she's attacking with an axe.

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Christian_bale_american_psycho_patrick_bateman_axe_10989289_RE_PwnzElite_has_declared_war_on_Grammar_Nazis-s400x300-173837

But to be fair, Ren's anger-face is kinda scary too:

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_ob6ckj9NuH1vahid5o1_540
ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_ob6ckj9NuH1vahid5o2_540
ARCHIVE: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors - 9 - Page 4 Tumblr_ob6ckj9NuH1vahid5o3_540
@Rimfaxe96

This is gold. lol!
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