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Post by Darth_Awakened on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 5:46 am

For all of us who are not so SW experts:
What's Force Nexus or Vergence?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Vergence

I trained in one such place. A nexus of Force energy on a small swamp world."
―Luke Skywalker, describing the Dark Side Cave on Dagobah[src]
A vergence, or nexus point, was a phenomenon of the Force that was centered around a place or object; and in rare instances around an individual. A vergence was a place in the galaxy where the Force flowed the most freely, in a concentrated wellspring of energy that could be more easily harnessed by those sensitive to its power.

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Post by Darth_Awakened on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 6:23 am

If Dagobah cave was a nexus, or Anakin was a nexus - I wonder if that nexus is forming every time when Kylo and Rey are in proximity of each other?
hmmmmm - possibilities?
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Post by spacebaby45678 on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 6:28 am

Old pre TFA rumors...

Luke himself is the Vergence/Nexus
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Post by Piper Maru on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 6:38 am

@Darth_Awakened wrote:If Dagobah cave was a nexus, or Anakin was a nexus - I wonder if that nexus is forming every time when Kylo and Rey are in proximity of each other?
hmmmmm - possibilities?
@Darth_Awakened

Wow. I think it would make their relationship far more intense/dangerous than with a "Force bond".

1. Kylo's desire for power would be dependent of Rey's presence (he would be more powerful around her than alone). 2. Rey would need to deal with the situation to grow up as a person/Force user (and it would be a character test for her). 3. At some point, they would need to come to terms and fight together for the greater good (defeat Snoke or something like that).
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Post by Darth Dingbat on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 7:02 am

@Piper Maru wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:If Dagobah cave was a nexus, or Anakin was a nexus - I wonder if that nexus is forming every time when Kylo and Rey are in proximity of each other?
hmmmmm - possibilities?
@Darth_Awakened

Wow. I think it would make their relationship far more intense/dangerous than with a "Force bond".

1. Kylo's desire for power would be dependent of Rey's presence (he would be more powerful around her than alone). 2. Rey would need to deal with the situation to grow up as a person/Force user (and it would be a character test for her). 3. At some point, they would need to come to terms and fight together for the greater good (defeat Snoke or something like that).
@Piper Maru

Actually, it seems to me it might be the other way round - at least in TFA, Rey was always freakishly powerful in Kylo's presence. Kylo less. And that was one of the reasons why I found the dynamic so exciting. She pulled the rug from under his feet, but the more he stumbled and failed, the more intrigued he was by her potential. I feel like Kylo realised she was "downloading" her new skills from him, and he wanted to teach her, to help her reach her potential. That admiration of her raw potential is why Reylo is so incredibly exciting to me.

But right now I can't think of any instance where Kylo gained any power from her, yet. I imagine they might both be powerful together if they learn to "share" that power and work together for a common goal. For this to happen, Rey would probably have to open up to Kylo the way he almost instinctively seemed to open up to her.

But this type of thing would also be dependent on some kind of a pre-destined "Force bond", surely - some shared element between them that "clicks" together.
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Post by Piper Maru on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 7:32 am

@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@Piper Maru wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:If Dagobah cave was a nexus, or Anakin was a nexus - I wonder if that nexus is forming every time when Kylo and Rey are in proximity of each other?
hmmmmm - possibilities?
@Darth_Awakened

Wow. I think it would make their relationship far more intense/dangerous than with a "Force bond".

1. Kylo's desire for power would be dependent of Rey's presence (he would be more powerful around her than alone). 2. Rey would need to deal with the situation to grow up as a person/Force user (and it would be a character test for her). 3. At some point, they would need to come to terms and fight together for the greater good (defeat Snoke or something like that).
@Piper Maru

Actually, it seems to me it might be the other way round - at least in TFA, Rey was always freakishly powerful in Kylo's presence. Kylo less. And that was one of the reasons why I found the dynamic so exciting. She pulled the rug from under his feet, but the more he stumbled and failed, the more intrigued he was by her potential. I feel like Kylo realised she was "downloading" her new skills from him, and he wanted to teach her, to help her reach her potential. That admiration of her raw potential is why Reylo is so incredibly exciting to me.

But right now I can't think of any instance where Kylo gained any power from her, yet. I imagine they might both be powerful together if they learn to "share" that power and work together for a common goal. For this to happen, Rey would probably have to open up to Kylo the way he almost instinctively seemed to open up to her.

But this type of thing would also be dependent on some kind of a pre-destined "Force bond", surely - some shared element between them that "clicks" together.
@Darth Dingbat

Oh, definitely a connection would be necessary, but not the "I'm reading your mind all the time and feeling your feels" bond that we tend to assume.

Maybe Kylo felt "invigorated" by Rey in a way he didn't feel when he killed Han Solo? I mean, I know she kicked his a** several times, but he still wanted to teach her, implying that he felt something about the whole situation that we're not seeing (yet).
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Post by Gemini on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 7:55 am

@SanghaRen wrote:Not sure if it was posted already.

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Seems like the first 2 are a sentence at least. Both conceived around the same time.

Third may be something connected and just not decided yet or it will be something totally new and not connected to the other two.

Pablo doesn't deny that the first 2 are a sentence as well. Which is interesting.
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Post by MindAndMagic on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 8:46 am

I don't think even the first two were meant to form a sentence as they refer to two different things. The awakening was always about Rey, even Pablo himself commented on this some time ago. From the looks of it TLJ most likely refers to Luke as the last one of his kind (obviously this could change but as of right now neither Rey nor Kylo can be described as Jedi). Titles always tease out the essence of what the movie is about. With TFA that was the beginning of Rey's journey and discovering her force powers. The next chapter will give us information on the new lore, the circumstances surrounding Luke's exile, Ben's backstory, and, most importantly, Rey's role in all this.
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 9:04 am

Queen of the Knights wrote:I don't think even the first two were meant to form a sentence as they refer to two different things. The awakening was always about Rey, even Pablo himself commented on this some time ago. From the looks of it TLJ most likely refers to Luke as the last one of his kind (obviously this could change but as of right now neither Rey nor Kylo can be described as Jedi). Titles always tease out the essence of what the movie is about. With TFA that was the beginning of Rey's journey and discovering her force powers. The next chapter will give us information on the new lore, the circumstances surrounding Luke's exile, Ben's backstory, and, most importantly, Rey's role in all this.
@Queen of the Knights
Indeed, I also see Pablo's response as a debunk of the theory that the titles are meant to be a sentence completed by the last title at all, but that does depend on how you read it as it's open to some interpretation. I really think the fact that even the first two happen to be a sentence when read together is more lucky coincidence than anything. A lot of different titles would have continued the sentence (if they started with "the" or "a" and lead to any kind of adjective/noun combination like "The Jast Jedi", "A New Hope" or "The Phantom Menace").
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Post by Gemini on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 9:16 am

@Queen of the Knights

Hope Pablo would just flat out say no about the sentence thing. Would be handy.

However again just the aesthetics of the title does still make me think it was a conscious decision

I can't see how it doesn't connect a meaningful sentence?

If rey is the awakening then it would mean that rey awakens the last Jedi Luke. That's where she's going at the end of episode 7 right?

She's going to awaken Luke from his self inflicted purgatory and bring him home.
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 9:22 am

@Gemini wrote:@Queen of the Knights

Hope Pablo would just flat out say no about the sentence thing. Would be handy.

However again just the aesthetics of the title does still make me think it was a conscious decision

I can't see how it doesn't connect a meaningful sentence?

If rey is the awakening then it would mean that rey awakens the last Jedi Luke. That's where she's going at the end of episode 7 right?

She's going to awaken Luke from his self inflicted purgatory and bring him home.
@Gemini
I agree that the sentence has meaning in itself, but in my eyes it's even cooler in this case if it was unintentional and just a coincidence, because what an ironic coincidence!
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Post by Guest on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 7:13 pm

Another thing we were right about.  Smile

ARCHIVE: Discussion: Tweets/Instagram - 9 - Page 5 Mindtr10

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Post by BastilaBey on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 7:17 pm

He's said something similar before, right after TFA was released. Something like "how cool would it be if she got it from Kylo's mind?"
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Post by Piper Maru on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 7:25 pm

reylosaur wrote:Another thing we were right about.  Smile

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The novel says this very clearly (I know it's not even vetted by LF, but it's there Laughing ), complete with Kylo Ren angry and afraid of what Rey learned inside his mind.
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Post by Xylo Ren on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 7:47 pm

reylosaur wrote:Another thing we were right about.  Smile

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@reylosaur

THIS IS THE RAMIFICATION THEY SPOKE OF. IT'S GOING TO PLAY A HUGE ROLE IN THEIR FUTURE.

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Post by Xylo Ren on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 8:44 pm

@MeadowofAshes wrote:
RandomObserver wrote:I geeked out when I read that. I'm fairly sure she's either a Kenobi or someone especially significant to the Galaxy, but this pretty much sets things straight with her not being related to the Skywalkers. Also, with the comment above, last night we re-watched SWTFA, and I had a thought as Rey was using the mind trick and Kylo Ren left Snoke, storming the corridors to go retrieve her; what if he was somehow sending her instructions mentally on what to do, like he told her telepathically or somehow suggested it through the force to use the mind trick to escape, because he didn't want to take her to Snoke? Just a thought. But I am so stoked PH said that!
@RandomObserver

I don't know about Kylo sending her escape tips, but I have no doubt that's how he knew she planned on stealing a ship. They picked things up from each other. I'm stoked about the "future ramifications"; no reason to have the "ways of the Force" moment if we don't see that used again. Imagine the powers we'll see with their minds combined!
@MeadowofAshes

I can picture Rey being furious that she ever got anything from that "monster's" brain and Kylo being annoyed that she took from him tricks that ultimately led to her escape and his defeat. Can you imagine her conversation with Luke?

I love the drama of it all Pop corn
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Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 9:14 pm

@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@Piper Maru wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:If Dagobah cave was a nexus, or Anakin was a nexus - I wonder if that nexus is forming every time when Kylo and Rey are in proximity of each other?
hmmmmm - possibilities?
@Darth_Awakened

Wow. I think it would make their relationship far more intense/dangerous than with a "Force bond".

1. Kylo's desire for power would be dependent of Rey's presence (he would be more powerful around her than alone). 2. Rey would need to deal with the situation to grow up as a person/Force user (and it would be a character test for her). 3. At some point, they would need to come to terms and fight together for the greater good (defeat Snoke or something like that).
@Piper Maru

Actually, it seems to me it might be the other way round - at least in TFA, Rey was always freakishly powerful in Kylo's presence. Kylo less. And that was one of the reasons why I found the dynamic so exciting. She pulled the rug from under his feet, but the more he stumbled and failed, the more intrigued he was by her potential. I feel like Kylo realised she was "downloading" her new skills from him, and he wanted to teach her, to help her reach her potential. That admiration of her raw potential is why Reylo is so incredibly exciting to me.

But right now I can't think of any instance where Kylo gained any power from her, yet. I imagine they might both be powerful together if they learn to "share" that power and work together for a common goal. For this to happen, Rey would probably have to open up to Kylo the way he almost instinctively seemed to open up to her.

But this type of thing would also be dependent on some kind of a pre-destined "Force bond", surely - some shared element between them that "clicks" together.
@Darth Dingbat

Ooh ooh ooh! That would make a lot of sense.

I just thought of something... If Rey grows more powerful when Kylo is around, could him landing on Jakku (going after LST) be the thing that set off Rey's initial "awakening"?
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Post by Piper Maru on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 9:25 pm

@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@Piper Maru wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:If Dagobah cave was a nexus, or Anakin was a nexus - I wonder if that nexus is forming every time when Kylo and Rey are in proximity of each other?
hmmmmm - possibilities?
@Darth_Awakened

Wow. I think it would make their relationship far more intense/dangerous than with a "Force bond".

1. Kylo's desire for power would be dependent of Rey's presence (he would be more powerful around her than alone). 2. Rey would need to deal with the situation to grow up as a person/Force user (and it would be a character test for her). 3. At some point, they would need to come to terms and fight together for the greater good (defeat Snoke or something like that).
@Piper Maru

Actually, it seems to me it might be the other way round - at least in TFA, Rey was always freakishly powerful in Kylo's presence. Kylo less. And that was one of the reasons why I found the dynamic so exciting. She pulled the rug from under his feet, but the more he stumbled and failed, the more intrigued he was by her potential. I feel like Kylo realised she was "downloading" her new skills from him, and he wanted to teach her, to help her reach her potential. That admiration of her raw potential is why Reylo is so incredibly exciting to me.

But right now I can't think of any instance where Kylo gained any power from her, yet. I imagine they might both be powerful together if they learn to "share" that power and work together for a common goal. For this to happen, Rey would probably have to open up to Kylo the way he almost instinctively seemed to open up to her.

But this type of thing would also be dependent on some kind of a pre-destined "Force bond", surely - some shared element between them that "clicks" together.
@Darth Dingbat

Ooh ooh ooh! That would make a lot of sense.

I just thought of something... If Rey grows more powerful when Kylo is around, could him landing on Jakku (going after LST) be the thing that set off Rey's initial "awakening"?
@ISeeAnIsland

Definitely. He was responsible for Rey's awakening in several ways.

Even without a "Force Bond" or whatever, they're still connected. We'll know more about her Force sensitivity in TLJ, but I think it's safe to assume that Kylo's presence on Jakku created a very specific chain of events that led to Rey's awakening. Kylo went there because the map was personal to him, but it was not necessary. Without his presence there, nothing would have happened.
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Post by snufkin on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 9:51 pm

@Piper Maru wrote:
@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@Piper Maru wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:If Dagobah cave was a nexus, or Anakin was a nexus - I wonder if that nexus is forming every time when Kylo and Rey are in proximity of each other?
hmmmmm - possibilities?
@Darth_Awakened

Wow. I think it would make their relationship far more intense/dangerous than with a "Force bond".

1. Kylo's desire for power would be dependent of Rey's presence (he would be more powerful around her than alone). 2. Rey would need to deal with the situation to grow up as a person/Force user (and it would be a character test for her). 3. At some point, they would need to come to terms and fight together for the greater good (defeat Snoke or something like that).
@Piper Maru

Actually, it seems to me it might be the other way round - at least in TFA, Rey was always freakishly powerful in Kylo's presence. Kylo less. And that was one of the reasons why I found the dynamic so exciting. She pulled the rug from under his feet, but the more he stumbled and failed, the more intrigued he was by her potential. I feel like Kylo realised she was "downloading" her new skills from him, and he wanted to teach her, to help her reach her potential. That admiration of her raw potential is why Reylo is so incredibly exciting to me.

But right now I can't think of any instance where Kylo gained any power from her, yet. I imagine they might both be powerful together if they learn to "share" that power and work together for a common goal. For this to happen, Rey would probably have to open up to Kylo the way he almost instinctively seemed to open up to her.

But this type of thing would also be dependent on some kind of a pre-destined "Force bond", surely - some shared element between them that "clicks" together.
@Darth Dingbat

Ooh ooh ooh! That would make a lot of sense.

I just thought of something... If Rey grows more powerful when Kylo is around, could him landing on Jakku (going after LST) be the thing that set off Rey's initial "awakening"?
@ISeeAnIsland

Definitely. He was responsible for Rey's awakening in several ways.

Even without a "Force Bond" or whatever, they're still connected. We'll know more about her Force sensitivity in TLJ, but I think it's safe to assume that Kylo's presence on Jakku created a very specific chain of events that led to Rey's awakening. Kylo went there because the map was personal to him, but it was not necessary. Without his presence there, nothing would have happened.

@Piper Maru

He kicks the whole thing off by crashing Poe's meeting with LST and bringing Finn along with the rest of the troops. So the story becomes both a Round Robin between the four main characters and in turn, Kylo's arrival at Jakku kicking off both Rey's awakening and finally leaving Jakku. It also breaks down the two main plots of the ST and primary relationships:

Finn and Poe (aka "You need a pilot") - including how Poe triggers Finn's moral awakening by shooting his friend
Rey and Kylo/Ben (aka "You need a teacher") - I'm guessing that there will be a parallel "this is a rescue" moment for Rey once she figures out Kylo/Ben's situation under Snoke's control

The Round Robin is also the relationships between the main three characters, including the two men being foils/antagonists for each other and likely also involved with Rey. I had initially thought/worried that it'd be a dumb love triangle, although I'd guess now it's still a triangle except that Rey will be torn by her loyalty to Finn because he's the closest she has to family/adopted brother.
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Post by snufkin on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 12:15 am

@Xylo Ren wrote:
@MeadowofAshes

I can picture Rey being furious that she ever got anything from that "monster's" brain and Kylo being annoyed that she took from him tricks that ultimately led to her escape and his defeat. Can you imagine her conversation with Luke?

I love the drama of it all Pop corn

@Xylo Ren

I'm really looking forward to that part. Poor Luke stuck with two horny, sniping teenagers.

As for the ship stealing part, I figured that he knew from intel from Jakku and going through her memory, that she was capable of hot wiring and flying a ship like the MF. No mean feat. And because Finn had busted Poe out to steal a ship, it was the most logical course of action. Not that he had some special insight to her thoughts after she'd broke out of her cell (and he's going to be in big trouble with his boss for having 2 high profile prisoners bust out and escape)
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Post by Saracene on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 1:24 am

I wonder if TLJ will explicitly point out that Rey got the mind trick from Kylo, since "how on earth did Rey learn about the Jedi mind trick" was one of the biggest complaints after TFA's release. Heck, Rey herself didn't seem to know how she managed it and mostly looked confused about the whole thing.

Also, I don't know if this implies an ongoing mental connection, though personally I always liked the theory of Force bond or something along these lines.
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Post by spacebaby45678 on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 3:34 am

Don't know if anyone has posted this tweet yet, but I think it is cute that Mario & Adam are kinda homeboys...

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Post by Rogue Rey on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 4:46 am

@Saracene wrote:I wonder if TLJ will explicitly point out that Rey got the mind trick from Kylo, since "how on earth did Rey learn about the Jedi mind trick" was one of the biggest complaints after TFA's release. Heck, Rey herself didn't seem to know how she managed it and mostly looked confused about the whole thing.

Also, I don't know if this implies an ongoing mental connection, though personally I always liked the theory of Force bond or something along these lines.
@Saracene

Confused and then when Finn asked her how she escaped she said 'I can't explain it. And you wouldn't believe it.' It wouldn't be the easiest thing to explain especially when you don't understand it yourself.
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ARCHIVE: Discussion: Tweets/Instagram - 9 - Page 5 Empty Re: ARCHIVE: Discussion: Tweets/Instagram - 9

Post by Scavengerscum on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 8:03 am

Fassbender and Weaving?! Thats... a little alarming. Would anyone have any idea how early in TFAs conception they would have been thinking of using those actors? I mean, Adam Drivers age and youth is makes sense in the context of him being Han and Leia's son...and also Reylo. I can't imagine that happening with Weaving or Fassbender...

Scavengerscum
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Post by spacebaby45678 on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 8:07 am

Something else to consider, if Fassbender was considered for the Villain... then the villain would not have been Han/Leia son or Luke's son. The dude is just too old. So the changes you see in the end product that JJ produced are the male characters switching places. Sam or Skyler was the Skywalker and or Solo.

@Scavengerscum

exactly
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