TLJ - Nailing down the timeline (NO SPOILERS)

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Post by reylo1992 on Mon 16 Oct 2017, 6:28 pm

@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@vaderito wrote:@DarthRen You are right. they won't go back to Supremacy once they take off. It's done. Climax will have to be on Crait but it cannot be just Poe sliding under AT-AT and Chewie blowing up crystals. Where's a drama?
@vaderito

Supremacy takes high priority but there is something strange going with Crait. Kylo marching with stormtroopers, shuttle. Finn, Rose and Rey all there. Snoke is gonna just disappear? Where is Luke in all of this?

Chewie blowing up things, Poe leading charge is not exactly a drama with two supporting characters. There has to be main characters involved. It has to be Kylo, Rey and Luke if Snoke is out of picture. Maybe Kylo tries to take control over FO and has some plan of his own.
@DarthRen

I thought you dislike the idea of Kylo becoming more evil Wink

I wouldn't understand what's the point if Snoke comes out of picture for the final stage of the battle. That would be completely weird. The guy will order the FO to attack the Resistance on Crait so it doesn't seem like it's the Fo that will be attacked by surprise. And he decides to be in the middle of the Space battle with his ship although it is potentially dangerous. for him. The stake must be f****ing important to make him go there. I am pretty confident that he will find a way to come to Crait after the explosion of Supremacy because this is most probably the planet itself he has some interest in .

As for Kylo having his own plan: possible. I think it depends on the circumstances. Pretty clear that Kylo ain't set as the main villain of the ST. And yet, he seems to lead his troops with such a proud and determined way of walking. And the cape doesn't help to make him less villain-type
@reylo1992

I do not but my idea is more Kylo getting free from Snoke and doing things his own way ala what Anakin/Vader wanted. Rule the galaxy on his own. But if he becomes more evil, I mean we have to look at it as a possibility.

Whaever is on Crait, what Resistance has or Rey herself must be super important for his plan but I like the idea that Snoke is just an illusion and not really that close to the action. Some leakers said he's like alchymist or can create illusions. Basically he'd be there but at the same will be safe.

Then Kylo after his bertayal might do what Snoke intended or some stuff on his own. So he takes stormtroopers and march with them.
@DarthRen

That's a possibility.

What bothers me there is that a large part of the GA seems to see Kylo as the villain and seemed to forget the importance of Snoke. And yet, thetrailer made it pretty who is the creepy villain and who is the conflicted antagonist.

If that wasn't clear enough for the GA in TFA because some of Snoke's lines weren't in the movie, it seems to me that the message of the trailer was pretty clear. Same for Andy Serkis saying during an interview that the interviewer is "onto something" about what "Snoke really wants from Kylo Ren"

So it's strange to think that Snoke wouldn't be that important for the final stage. Or that he would be overthrown by Kylo. And having two villains potentially equally powerful and power-hungry, I don't know...

I guess that that shot about Kylo on Crait will make us think a lot regarding the timeline and Kylo's arc until it comes out.
@reylo1992

But whatdoes he wants from him? That is the question. His powers, Rey, Luke, combinations of it or something else? Whatever it is, it ain't good.
@DarthRen

I agree I think that's actually the question to think about deeply to understand where the story is headed because this is what could drive that story.

What are the plans of this villain now that :
1) SKB has been destroyed
2) Skywalker could come back from one moment to another
3) A strong FS girl both represent a menace and an opportunity

And how does he intend to fulfill his long-term agenda with Kylo now that his "protege" has indeed passed the test - killed his father - but failed to keep aside his personal feelings.interests (hismother, the girl) to achieve his mission? That's where the story is headed IMO: Snoke's agenda will heavily impact the plot of the story, the different arcs and the timeline.
@reylo1992

When Han said he's using himfor his power. It could be literally that he wants his powers or using those powers to get something. I mean he created SKB and invested a lot as you've said. So whatever he plans, it not only requires Kylo and his powers but also something else. Luke might know what since Snoke fear his return.

If Snoke wants Kylo's body, powers he could be invincible but it doesn't seem like it only thing. There is something bigger, more sinister than Palpatine's manipulations going on. Something Luke might wanted to find out. It would be good if we know if Snoke knew Luke before and what kind of role he exactly played, where he comes from.
@DarthRen

I think that Han's line pretty much foreshadow Ben's fate. It can't be a random line. I don't know if Han was completely in the dark about Kylo but it seems that a lot of the mess in the Skywalker family was based on untold truth:
1) Han/Leia/Luke didn't tell Ben about Vader
2) Leia didn't tell Han about Snoke's watching their son from birth.However, when Leia revealed him that Snoke was watching over Ben always from the shadow, it's as if Han had realized something.

So I guess that there are other untold truths. What strikes me is how much Luke and Han seem resigned to Ben's fate. One could argue that Han wasn't as patient and understanding as Leia but maybe Han knew from Luke something that Luke couldn't bring himself to tell to Leia and maybe Han himself couldn't bring himself to tell Leia. It really seems like Han thought there was too much Vader in Ben and that there was nothing to do. And when he died, he seemed to be resigned to his fate because it was meant to happen. So my feeling is that Luke will behave pretty much like Han: he will consider that there is nothing to do because he probably knows something and that he considers that one can't go against this fate.

If both Han and Luke weren't resigned by Ben's fate,I don't think they would have abandoned the fight that easily.
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Post by reylo1992 on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 3:30 am

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Post by SanghaRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:05 am

@reylo1992

I very rarely read blogs on movies, just like I rarely watch podcasts or read metas. I guess it’s because I prefer interacting with people and exchanging ideas and not just be on the receiving end. I did read that one though. Even though I am not the type to try to nail down the timeline, I have some flashes of where some scenes could make sense in the timeline and they mostly concur with the timeline in this blog. I also don’t see Crait as the last scene. I am still not convinced though that the hand reach is the last Kylo and Rey scene. If it is indeed towards the very end of the movie, I think there would be another scene afterwards, a glimpse of what they are up to next.

You know this timeline makes so much sense that part of me is like “no way”. Plus, I would be a bit disappointed that there is no real surprise anymore even if I do like this potential timeline.

One thing though that I am missing is the Force mythology aspect. Why are Kylo and Rey that powerful? I mean everything is making sense but I am missing the “weird” part. RJ loves games, he must have something up his sleeve. It just does not sound weird enough to me. But then, maybe I am already too deep into this whole fandom thing and don’t realize it’s weird enough for the GA. And do I want to know the “weird” if there is more “weird” indeed? I am torn.

My jaw dropped a bit at the potential death of Poe because it is true, usually characters who make that kind of speech end up dying. Why did I not think of that? I mean I am not the biggest fan, but that would upset quite a few people.
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Post by reylo1992 on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:15 am

@SanghaRen wrote:
@reylo1992

I very rarely read blogs on movies, just like I rarely watch podcasts or read metas. I guess it’s because I prefer interacting with people and exchanging ideas and not just be on the receiving end. I did read that one though. Even though I am not the type to try to nail down the timeline, I have some flashes of where some scenes could make sense in the timeline and they mostly concur with the timeline in this blog. I also don’t see Crait as the last scene. I am still not convinced though that the hand reach is the last Kylo and Rey scene. If it is indeed towards the very end of the movie, I think there would be another scene afterwards, a glimpse of what they are up to next.

You know this timeline makes so much sense that part of me is like “no way”. Plus, I would be a bit disappointed that there is no real surprise anymore even if I do like this potential timeline.

One thing though that I am missing is the Force mythology aspect. Why are Kylo and Rey that powerful? I mean everything is making sense but I am missing the “weird” part. RJ loves games, he must have something up his sleeve. It just does not sound weird enough to me. But then, maybe I am already too deep into this whole fandom thing and don’t realize it’s weird enough for the GA. And do I want to know the “weird” if there is one? I am torn.

My jaw dropped a bit at the potential death of Poe because it is true, usually characters who make that kind of speech end up dying. Why did I not think of that?
@SanghaRen

I must say that there are a lot of things I disagree with the timeline but the person did a great job in gathering pics and try to find to logical timeline between them. I don't think I.e. that Crait would happen that early in the movie even if Kylo wears his cape. This would mean that there are three battle in such a few lapse of time (Act I: D'Qar; Act II: Crait; Act III: Supremacy).

What misses in this post IMO is a general guiding idea that drives where the story of the ST is headed. But the person insisted about that: this no meta so he/she is not trying to figure out what is the TLJ story about and i.e. how the villain's intention drive the plot. In the end, he/she tries to gather facts and assemble them the most logical way he/she can.

I unfortunately think that he/she is right about Poe's fate. He was already supposed to die in TFA.So I suppose that they will give him a heroic death.
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Post by vaderito on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:21 am

I have trouble with time;line cause I absolutely don't care about Poe's part of the story. That's something that I always try to forget that exists. I'm just not invested in the Resistance, don't want them to win, etc. So my concern are only Force Plot and FinnRose but since there's that other plot that I'm not invested in, my timeline is messed up.

That said, since Kylo has his cape on Crait and in promo with Guards (but no band aid), I'm not buying training with Guards. If he fights them it's going to be against them, not just one training scene and that's it.

That said, this seems to be the same scene judging by smoke and embers in both, as well as the character outfit (Kylo is cape-less and Rey should be in her Jedi Training outfit when he proposes):

TLJ - Nailing down the timeline (NO SPOILERS) - Page 6 NGa61e1g8kAOeY_k86u_TXjP5TcMDhRCrhZDGmKin6M

Question is when and where this happens? Some fire is there. They may have been fighting or about to fight but he decided against it. Reminds me of

Basically, says that Rey goes off with Snoke at the end when theyre all on a destroyer and betrays Kylo Ren when he won't kill rey.

https://www.reddit.com/r/starwarsspeculation/comments/6bvdeo/tlj_details/
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Post by DarthRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:34 am

From spoilers and rumours thread.

@vaderito wrote:@DarthRen Kylo Cape appears on Crait, obviously, but also in promo with Guards which takes place somewhere indoors - Supremacy or some base?
@vaderito

From BTS footage he sits in some room and has a cape, then with Hux, on Crait and then when given lecture by Snoke. Me thinks these scenes are Act I and II, and then Kylo ditches cape. Having cape and not having from scene to scene in various Act would be really weird. Maybe even Kylo marching with Stormtropers isn't Crait at all.

Hand gesture, Kylo watching preparations of FO attack are from the end of the movie Act III due to his costume, as Rian said basically showing him more vulnerable and if ROTS is any insppiration, Anakin later in the final act ditched robes and had a similar costume to what Kylo has or luke had in ROTJ.


To your comment about Rey leaving with Snoke. What if she really goes with him? One of the bad choices our heroes will make? Daisy herself said that Rey will make a questionable choices. I mean it also fits with Kylo being disillusioned, offers Kylo and Finn unlikrly team up.

I'm really starting to think Rey will ditch Kylo for Snoke.
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Post by vaderito on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:39 am

@DarthRen I agree that he'll ditch the cape at the end but it may appear/disappear in the movie several times like his cowl.

I'm just trying really hard to figure out if they are outside or indoors and I can't see.
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Post by SanghaRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:50 am

@reylo1992

Oh, the person did a good job. I read the “disclaimer”. It was more of a rant with myself on the “weird”.

As I said, I am not the type to nail down the timeline so it was more a general feeling. But now that you mention it, I realize that in my head Crait and the Supremacy happen at the same time, so I guess more towards the end, but I still think there’ll be more. I just had this image of Kylo and Rey connecting on the Supremacy and whoosh the ship is gone from the sky as an end. Gone to the outer rims. Yes, I still drool at the idea of knowing what the heck is there. Is that too Star-Trek-y?

Why do most people assume caped Kylo is automatically on Crait? Because it’s red? Also why should Rey be on Crait? She might just have been shooting scenes on a neighboring set?

And now thinking about the hand reach, I even could see the hand reach earlier before Crait. Maybe this hand reach is actually to connect through the Force before that famous hut explosion.

@DarthRen

That’s right. Daisy did imply Rey makes questionable choices. What could it be and when? Rey leaving with Snoke would be quite something.

Side note: I hope that cape burns. I hate it.

EDIT

Btw I could not see all the pics in the blog which annoyed me. Must be the slow connection. Otherwise, I am so bored to death in the office that I would have printed them out and played timeline puzzle.


Last edited by SanghaRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:54 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by reylo1992 on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:51 am

@DarthRen wrote:From spoilers and rumours thread.

@vaderito wrote:@DarthRen Kylo Cape appears on Crait, obviously, but also in promo with Guards which takes place somewhere indoors - Supremacy or some base?
@vaderito

From BTS footage he sits in some room and has a cape, then with Hux, on Crait and then when given lecture by Snoke. Me thinks these scenes are Act I and II, and then Kylo ditches cape. Having cape and not having from scene to scene in various Act would be really weird. Maybe even Kylo marching with Stormtropers isn't Crait at all.

Hand gesture, Kylo watching preparations of FO attack are from the end of the movie Act III due to his costume, as Rian said basically showing him more vulnerable and if ROTS is any insppiration, Anakin later in the final act ditched robes and had a similar costume to what Kylo has or luke had in ROTJ.


To your comment about Rey leaving with Snoke. What if she really goes with him? One of the bad choices our heroes will make? Daisy herself said that Rey will make a questionable choices. I mean it also fits with Kylo being disillusioned, offers Kylo and Finn unlikrly team up.

I'm really starting to think Rey will ditch Kylo for Snoke.
@DarthRen

That's pretty hard for me to imagine Rey ditching Kylo for Snoke and leaving with Snoke on her own will. She looks in great pain in the trailer: I doubt she would follow someone who hurt her like that unless Snoke is actually awakening something dark within her.

As for Kylo/Finn team up, I can completely imagine it. Kylo owns something to Finn for having wounded him. So if he saves Finn from Phasma, I would be happy with this.


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Post by DarthRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 8:55 am

@SanghaRen

That same person said Kylo kills Phasma, Kylo bertreyed by Snoke and Kylo is on Snoke's crashing ship with Finn and Poe. I think maybe it was meant to be Rose and not Poe. Bothan Spy also said Phasma will get a Skywalker treatment but it might not the worst thing happening to her, what is worst than that? Death. It kinda fits to it.

All around Rey rejects Kylo and goes with Snoke. Kylo saves Finn from Phasma. Basically a set up for Kylo and Finn to go after them, maybe Luke too. What I found shady is that Luke is in many leaks and rumours missing from the third act. He has to be there.
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Post by reylo1992 on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 9:00 am

@SanghaRen wrote:@reylo1992

Oh, the person did a good job. I read the “disclaimer”. It was more of a rant with myself on the “weird”.

As I said, I am not the type to nail down the timeline so it was more a general feeling. But now that you mention it, I realize that in my head Crait and the Supremacy happen at the same time, so I guess more towards the end, but I still think there’ll be more. I just had this image of Kylo and Rey connecting on the Supremacy and whoosh the ship is gone from the sky as an end. Gone to the outer rims. Yes, I still drool at the idea of knowing what the heck is there. Is that too Star-Trek-y?

Why do most people assume caped Kylo is automatically on Crait? Because it’s red? Also why should Rey be on Crait? She might just have been shooting scenes on a neighboring set?

And now thinking about the hand reach, I even could see the hand reach earlier before Crait. Maybe this hand reach is actually to connect through the Force before that famous hut explosion.

@DarthRen

That’s right. Daisy did imply Rey makes questionable choices. What could it be and when? Rey leaving with Snoke would be quite something.

Side note: I hope that cape burns. I hate it.
@SanghaRen

@SanghaRen wrote:@reylo1992

Oh, the person did a good job. I read the “disclaimer”. It was more of a rant with myself on the “weird”.

As I said, I am not the type to nail down the timeline so it was more a general feeling. But now that you mention it, I realize that in my head Crait and the Supremacy happen at the same time, so I guess more towards the end, but I still think there’ll be more. I just had this image of Kylo and Rey connecting on the Supremacy and whoosh the ship is gone from the sky as an end. Gone to the outer rims. Yes, I still drool at the idea of knowing what the heck is there. Is that too Star-Trek-y?

Why do most people assume caped Kylo is automatically on Crait? Because it’s red? Also why should Rey be on Crait? She might just have been shooting scenes on a neighboring set?

And now thinking about the hand reach, I even could see the hand reach earlier before Crait. Maybe this hand reach is actually to connect through the Force before that famous hut explosion.

@DarthRen

That’s right. Daisy did imply Rey makes questionable choices. What could it be and when? Rey leaving with Snoke would be quite something.

Side note: I hope that cape burns. I hate it.
@SanghaRen

Rey leaving with Snoke on her own consent would be more than questionable. Snoke is the guy who is behind a weapon of massive destruction that blew up an entire system in TFA. Unless she is kinda forced to do it, I don't think she would run away with him.

IMO, the questionable decision have more to do with her complicated relationship in Kylo. I bet that everybody in the end of the movie can be called "Traitor" by someone else. In the case of Rey, she shares a connection with an ennemy of the Resistance and the Light Side. I would rather imagine that the questionable decisions has to do with exploring the connection in secret. I don't think that Rey would tell Finn:"Do you know? I regularly go on Force dates with the guy who nearly killed you on SKB while you were trying to save me". So I suppose that Rey would do certai nthings with Kylo behind the back of people who trust her. Who tells that she wouldn't give Kylo a key information about a Resistance's plan to keep him safe and the other way around?
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Post by reylo1992 on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 9:04 am

@DarthRen wrote:@SanghaRen

That same person said Kylo kills Phasma, Kylo bertreyed by Snoke and Kylo is on Snoke's crashing ship with Finn and Poe. I think maybe it was meant to be Rose and not Poe. Bothan Spy also said Phasma will get a Skywalker treatment but it might not the worst thing happening to her, what is worst than that? Death. It kinda fits to it.

All around Rey rejects Kylo and goes with Snoke. Kylo saves Finn from Phasma. Basically a set up for Kylo and Finn to go after them, maybe Luke too. What I found shady is that Luke is in many leaks and rumours missing from the third act. He has to be there.

@DarthRen

Not necessarily. Honestly, I tend to think that Luke will disappear from screen for a long while after Rey leavesAhch-To and will reappear only by the end for a key moment.
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Post by Blackcanary on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 9:05 am

@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:@SanghaRen

That same person said Kylo kills Phasma, Kylo bertreyed by Snoke and Kylo is on Snoke's crashing ship with Finn and Poe. I think maybe it was meant to be Rose and not Poe. Bothan Spy also said Phasma will get a Skywalker treatment but it might not the worst thing happening to her, what is worst than that? Death. It kinda fits to it.

All around Rey rejects Kylo and goes with Snoke. Kylo saves Finn from Phasma. Basically a set up for Kylo and Finn to go after them, maybe Luke too. What I found shady is that Luke is in many leaks and rumours missing from the third act. He has to be there.

@DarthRen

Not necessarily. Honestly, I tend to think that Luke will disappear from screen for a long while after Rey leavesAhch-To and will reappear only by the end for a key moment.
@reylo1992

I suspect we'll get a 'Gandalf' type moment with Luke, where we're led to believe he's either perished or permanently turned away from the fight, only for him to turn up at a moment of despair and save the day in some way.
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Post by vaderito on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 9:11 am

Where is the scene where Kylo is sitting in his cape? There's no cape and he's sitting:

TLJ - Nailing down the timeline (NO SPOILERS) - Page 6 Tumblr_ot5eq2Fc451t3n54uo2_500

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Post by SanghaRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 9:23 am

@DarthRen wrote:@SanghaRen

That same person said Kylo kills Phasma, Kylo bertreyed by Snoke and Kylo is on Snoke's crashing ship with Finn and Poe. I think maybe it was meant to be Rose and not Poe. Bothan Spy also said Phasma will get a Skywalker treatment but it might not the worst thing happening to her, what is worst than that? Death. It kinda fits to it.

All around Rey rejects Kylo and goes with Snoke. Kylo saves Finn from Phasma. Basically a set up for Kylo and Finn to go after them, maybe Luke too. What I found shady is that Luke is in many leaks and rumours missing from the third act. He has to be there.
@DarthRen

I think Rey could go with Snoke if he told her he knows things about her family. That’s a sore point for her.

Yeah, Luke being absent is very weird. And I am still hoping for a scene Luke/Leia. It’s hard for me to imagine that the space twins will not share a moment. That is not satisfactory in my book. Maybe we do have Luke and Leia looking up into space just like the end of ESB while the new generation is up for the next move?

@reylo1992

Idk. I don’t see it as very questionable to try and understand your power and accept the help of the only one who offers it. If you follow the timeline offered by the blogger, I don’t see the audience reacting as “how dare she!” It’s such a typical trope for the hero to team up with the “villain” along his/her journey to reach a certain target. And at this point, with this trailer, people are already prepared to see her “cosying up to the sinister Kylo Ren” as one journalist described it. So I don’t know, I have the feeling there’s more questionable to the story.
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Post by DarthRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 9:48 am

@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:From spoilers and rumours thread.

@vaderito wrote:@DarthRen Kylo Cape appears on Crait, obviously, but also in promo with Guards which takes place somewhere indoors - Supremacy or some base?
@vaderito

From BTS footage he sits in some room and has a cape, then with Hux, on Crait and then when given lecture by Snoke. Me thinks these scenes are Act I and II, and then Kylo ditches cape. Having cape and not having from scene to scene in various Act would be really weird. Maybe even Kylo marching with Stormtropers isn't Crait at all.

Hand gesture, Kylo watching preparations of FO attack are from the end of the movie Act III due to his costume, as Rian said basically showing him more vulnerable and if ROTS is any insppiration, Anakin later in the final act ditched robes and had a similar costume to what Kylo has or luke had in ROTJ.


To your comment about Rey leaving with Snoke. What if she really goes with him? One of the bad choices our heroes will make? Daisy herself said that Rey will make a questionable choices. I mean it also fits with Kylo being disillusioned, offers Kylo and Finn unlikrly team up.

I'm really starting to think Rey will ditch Kylo for Snoke.
@DarthRen

That's pretty hard for me to imagine Rey ditching Kylo for Snoke and leaving with Snoke on her own will. She looks in great pain in the trailer: I doubt she would follow someone who hurt her like that unless Snoke is actually awakening something dark within her.

As for Kylo/Finn team up, I can completely imagine it. Kylo owns something to Finn for having wounded him. So if he saves Finn from Phasma, I would be happy with this.


@reylo1992

It's just an idea. We're throwing it around here.

Snoke is a master manipulator, he lure her. If Rey is prone to DS which she very well might be and also he might know about her parents. Trailer wants us to believe she will go on with Kylo or Kylo will try to show her a way. Daisy did talked about choices  that audience might not like with Rey. Originally thought that Rey has to accept him but then it would leave Kylo and Rey together leaving somewhere, not much suspense.

Also it would establish Kylo and Finn alliance. Basically Rey might end up with Snoke, Kylo with the Resistance. Rian also said he left a mess and other director will have to pick up the pieces. It would be a set up with Finn and Kylo dynamic being explored.

Kylo being rejected by Rey, betrayed by Snoke, Resistance hates him and he has nowhere to go. This could be a good way to finish off his arc. He's no longer Kylo Ren but also not fully Ben Solo. He has to work with Finn to get Rey back and revenge on Snoke.


@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:@SanghaRen

That same person said Kylo kills Phasma, Kylo bertreyed by Snoke and Kylo is on Snoke's crashing ship with Finn and Poe. I think maybe it was meant to be Rose and not Poe. Bothan Spy also said Phasma will get a Skywalker treatment but it might not the worst thing happening to her, what is worst than that? Death. It kinda fits to it.

All around Rey rejects Kylo and goes with Snoke. Kylo saves Finn from Phasma. Basically a set up for Kylo and Finn to go after them, maybe Luke too. What I found shady is that Luke is in many leaks and rumours missing from the third act. He has to be there.

@DarthRen

Not necessarily. Honestly, I tend to think that Luke will disappear from screen for a long while after Rey leavesAhch-To and will reappear only by the end for a key moment.
@reylo1992

You mean that Luke will be only on Ach-To and at the end to not vershadow our new characters?
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 10:00 am

I 100% agree with the speculation that Tumblr user makes about Poe's suicide mission and the climax taking place on Snoke's Star Destroyer (after Poe has decided to just shoot the damn thing down). I don't think they make any big assumptions about the plot and everything is based on confirmed information, except their speculation, which is just that. It lines up very much with what I feel will be in the movie, give or take a few details. Also, A+ for the hand scene coming at the end of the movie and being the last scene we chronologically have. It can't be anything else in my mind. It just does not make sense anywhere else in the film.

https://jediwhinetrick.tumblr.com/post/166470171392/the-last-jedi-predictionsspeculationshead-canon
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Post by Guest on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 10:06 am

@vaderito wrote:Where is the scene where Kylo is sitting in his cape? There's no cape and he's sitting:

TLJ - Nailing down the timeline (NO SPOILERS) - Page 6 Tumblr_ot5eq2Fc451t3n54uo2_500

TLJ - Nailing down the timeline (NO SPOILERS) - Page 6 000263244hr
@vaderito

He is dressed the same as in that shot from the trailer where he’s staring out at the walkers being constructed. It seems like it might be early on in the movie because there is no space band-aid but his scar looks red and less healed than in the hand holding out scene, which we presume is later on or towards the end.

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Post by DarthRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 10:12 am

@SanghaRen wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:@SanghaRen

That same person said Kylo kills Phasma, Kylo bertreyed by Snoke and Kylo is on Snoke's crashing ship with Finn and Poe. I think maybe it was meant to be Rose and not Poe. Bothan Spy also said Phasma will get a Skywalker treatment but it might not the worst thing happening to her, what is worst than that? Death. It kinda fits to it.

All around Rey rejects Kylo and goes with Snoke. Kylo saves Finn from Phasma. Basically a set up for Kylo and Finn to go after them, maybe Luke too. What I found shady is that Luke is in many leaks and rumours missing from the third act. He has to be there.
@DarthRen

I think Rey could go with Snoke if he told her he knows things about her family. That’s a sore point for her.

Yeah, Luke being absent is very weird. And I am still hoping for a scene Luke/Leia. It’s hard for me to imagine that the space twins will not share a moment. That is not satisfactory in my book. Maybe we do have Luke and Leia looking up into space just like the end of ESB while the new generation is up for the next move?

@reylo1992

Idk. I don’t see it as very questionable to try and understand your power and accept the help of the only one who offers it. If you follow the timeline offered by the blogger, I don’t see the audience reacting as “how dare she!” It’s such a typical trope for the hero to team up with the “villain” along his/her journey to reach a certain target. And at this point, with this trailer, people are already prepared to see her “cosying up to the sinister Kylo Ren” as one journalist described it. So I don’t know, I have the feeling there’s more questionable to the story.
@SanghaRen

Could be her background, he might know about her parents or Rey might be showing pull to the Dark, like Kylo has to the Light.

Luke/Leia scene simply needs to happen. We had Han/Leia, but no Han/Luke scene. I think his submerged X-Wing might come handy for Act III.

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Post by reylo1992 on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 10:30 am

@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:From spoilers and rumours thread.

@vaderito wrote:@DarthRen Kylo Cape appears on Crait, obviously, but also in promo with Guards which takes place somewhere indoors - Supremacy or some base?
@vaderito

From BTS footage he sits in some room and has a cape, then with Hux, on Crait and then when given lecture by Snoke. Me thinks these scenes are Act I and II, and then Kylo ditches cape. Having cape and not having from scene to scene in various Act would be really weird. Maybe even Kylo marching with Stormtropers isn't Crait at all.

Hand gesture, Kylo watching preparations of FO attack are from the end of the movie Act III due to his costume, as Rian said basically showing him more vulnerable and if ROTS is any insppiration, Anakin later in the final act ditched robes and had a similar costume to what Kylo has or luke had in ROTJ.


To your comment about Rey leaving with Snoke. What if she really goes with him? One of the bad choices our heroes will make? Daisy herself said that Rey will make a questionable choices. I mean it also fits with Kylo being disillusioned, offers Kylo and Finn unlikrly team up.

I'm really starting to think Rey will ditch Kylo for Snoke.
@DarthRen

That's pretty hard for me to imagine Rey ditching Kylo for Snoke and leaving with Snoke on her own will. She looks in great pain in the trailer: I doubt she would follow someone who hurt her like that unless Snoke is actually awakening something dark within her.

As for Kylo/Finn team up, I can completely imagine it. Kylo owns something to Finn for having wounded him. So if he saves Finn from Phasma, I would be happy with this.


@reylo1992

It's just an idea. We're throwing it around here.

Snoke is a master manipulator, he lure her. If Rey is prone to DS which she very well might be and also he might know about her parents. Trailer wants us to believe she will go on with Kylo or Kylo will try to show her a way. Daisy did talked about choices  that audience might not like with Rey. Originally thought that Rey has to accept him but then it would leave Kylo and Rey together leaving somewhere, not much suspense.

Also it would establish Kylo and Finn alliance. Basically Rey might end up with Snoke, Kylo with the Resistance. Rian also said he left a mess and other director will have to pick up the pieces. It would be a set up with Finn and Kylo dynamic being explored.

Kylo being rejected by Rey, betrayed by Snoke, Resistance hates him and he has nowhere to go. This could be a good way to finish off his arc. He's no longer Kylo Ren but also not fully Ben Solo. He has to work with Finn to get Rey back and revenge on Snoke.


@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:@SanghaRen

That same person said Kylo kills Phasma, Kylo bertreyed by Snoke and Kylo is on Snoke's crashing ship with Finn and Poe. I think maybe it was meant to be Rose and not Poe. Bothan Spy also said Phasma will get a Skywalker treatment but it might not the worst thing happening to her, what is worst than that? Death. It kinda fits to it.

All around Rey rejects Kylo and goes with Snoke. Kylo saves Finn from Phasma. Basically a set up for Kylo and Finn to go after them, maybe Luke too. What I found shady is that Luke is in many leaks and rumours missing from the third act. He has to be there.
@DarthRen

Not necessarily. Honestly, I tend to think that Luke will disappear from screen for a long while after Rey leavesAhch-To and will reappear only  by the end for a key moment.
@reylo1992

You mean that Luke will be only on Ach-To and at the end to not vershadow our new characters?
@DarthRen

Yep! That's what I tend to think! J.J. already said once that the problem with Luke is that the presence of his character could overshadow the young generations. That's why he renounced to make him appear until the very end. And J.J. said himself that he would have loved to direct Mark Hamill more: he will anyway get that oportunity now Wink But yeah; I think that Luke will be set up as a grumpy old ermit during the first part of the movie. He doesn't want to get involved because he thinks it is the right thing to do to stay away. He is resigned to his fate, to Ben's fate, to the galaxy's fate. And he will indeed behave like aold crazy wizard. And thus, he won't be join at the Resistance base with Rey and the others. But something will probably make his mind change and he will show up in the end. This is how I see it. Now, does he shows up as the hero he wants to become again or as the antagonist, it is rather unclear for me.

EDIT:

But let's not forget what Mark Hamill said about Luke's relationship with Ben: Luke invested everything he had in Ben. Theywere probably close: Luke maybe considered Ben like his own son. And honestly, I am not so sure that Luke is that scared of Rey's power. I get the feeling that her raw power reminds him painfully of Ben because they're so similar:
TLJ - Nailing down the timeline (NO SPOILERS) - Page 6 Captur98
Seems like the old man has red eyes and tears ...just like here:
TLJ - Nailing down the timeline (NO SPOILERS) - Page 6 Captur18
And my feeling is that the tears have anything to do with the girl who tends the lightsaber..but maybe with its potential last owner (Kylo: That lightsaber! It belongs to me!)

So maybe that there is an emotional dimension in his rejection. Maybe it is hard for him to train a girl who shares so many similarities with Ben? So Idk : maybe thay Luke come to realize that there is still light in Ben and that he can still be saved.

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Post by Cowgirlsamurai on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 10:57 am

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I 100% agree with the speculation that Tumblr user makes about Poe's suicide mission and the climax taking place on Snoke's Star Destroyer (after Poe has decided to just shoot the damn thing down). I don't think they make any big assumptions about the plot and everything is based on confirmed information, except their speculation, which is just that. It lines up very much with what I feel will be in the movie, give or take a few details. Also, A+ for the hand scene coming at the end of the movie and being the last scene we chronologically have. It can't be anything else in my mind. It just does not make sense anywhere else in the film.

https://jediwhinetrick.tumblr.com/post/166470171392/the-last-jedi-predictionsspeculationshead-canon
@FrolickingFizzgig

I want to see this movie!!! I still have a hard time believing that the hand offer is the last thing we'll see in the film because it's in the trailer, but maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised, especially if Rey takes his hand Embarassed
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 11:03 am

@Cowgirlsamurai wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I 100% agree with the speculation that Tumblr user makes about Poe's suicide mission and the climax taking place on Snoke's Star Destroyer (after Poe has decided to just shoot the damn thing down). I don't think they make any big assumptions about the plot and everything is based on confirmed information, except their speculation, which is just that. It lines up very much with what I feel will be in the movie, give or take a few details. Also, A+ for the hand scene coming at the end of the movie and being the last scene we chronologically have. It can't be anything else in my mind. It just does not make sense anywhere else in the film.

https://jediwhinetrick.tumblr.com/post/166470171392/the-last-jedi-predictionsspeculationshead-canon
@FrolickingFizzgig

I want to see this movie!!! I still have a hard time believing that the hand offer is the last thing we'll see in the film because it's in the trailer, but maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised, especially if Rey takes his hand Embarassed
@Cowgirlsamurai
The thing is I don't think Kylo's offer is that much of a big deal (he already made the same offer and she shot it down). Rey's reaction, on the other hand, is a big deal because it'll probably be quite different. And there might be scenes after this (I'm betting on a Luke and Leia reunion). The point is it's the last scene we currently have chronologically in all our shots of scenes.
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Post by vaderito on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 11:26 am

Does anyone have a link to toy audio quotes that @nonesuch posted on her site? I think I figured out some possible dialog:

Luke: "Who are you?" (shareholder footage)

Rey:" I am with the Resistance" (toy)

Luke:' Why are you here?" (TLJ spot #1)

Rey:"The First order is everywhere." (toy)

This lines up with rumor or toy packaging that indicates that Rey was dispatched to Luke by Leia to recruit him, not because she needed help with the Force.

I think that the talk about the Force may come a bit later, possibly triggered by some display of the Force on Rey's part. Possible dialog:

Luke:"What do you know about the Force?" (toy)

Rey:"Something inside me has always been there. Then I was awake...I need someone to show me my place in all this." (trailer)

I think that both trailer lines may be the part of the same scene.
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Post by DarthRen on Tue 17 Oct 2017, 11:49 am

@vaderito wrote:Does anyone have a link to toy audio quotes that @nonesuch posted on her site? I think I figured out some possible dialog:

Luke: "Who are you?" (shareholder footage)

Rey:" I am with the Resistance" (toy)

Luke:' Why are you here?" (TLJ spot #1)

Rey:"The First order is everywhere." (toy)

This lines up with rumor or toy packaging that indicates that Rey was dispatched to Luke by Leia to recruit him, not because she needed help with the Force.

I think that the talk about the Force may come a bit later, possibly triggered by some display of the Force on Rey's part. Possible dialog:

Luke:"What do you know about the Force?" (toy)

Rey:"Something inside me has always been there. Then I was awake...I need someone to show me my place in all this." (trailer)

I think that both trailer lines may be the part of the same scene.
@vaderito

That would imply that Luke might try to teach her a bit after seeing her powers, but things will not go well, because girl has the same ůpowers as Ben.

Speaking of toys and lines.

Kylo's toy has a line "It's too late for that." I wonder in which scene it is.


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