Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

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Post by reylo1992 on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:41 pm

@Kylo Rey wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@Saracene wrote:Kylo killing Snoke would definitely be a "I can't believe they did it" moment, but if the movie is not delving much into Snoke, is it going to be, goodbye Supreme Leader Snoke, we hardly knew you? Seems weird.
@Saracene
And Andy Serkis had this to say:

“He’s definitely not a Sith, but he’s certainly at the darker end of the Force. Without giving too much away, that begins to unfold a little in this one.”
@teltaru wrote:Unbelievably, there are signs pointing to this stuff being true after all. I'm not sold though, not yet. Where is the story behind Ben's fall? Is he going to be on Crait the same time as Leia and not meet her in an emotional scene? The BTS reel pretty much confirmed they filmed scenes together. I think I've read every version of this leak including the Reylo shippers' one and none of them discuss these plot points. Also, this is my personal opinion, but how do all those cheery reactions line up with Luke freaking Skywalker dying in the end? Confusing.
@teltaru
There are zero signs pointing to Luke becoming a flipping hologram and fighting Kylo across space being true. The problem is everything has become a mess of various fanfictions combined with reaction interpretations.
@FrolickingFizzgig

That Andy Serkis quote is the biggest proof right there that Snoke doesn't die in this one and therefore renders most of these 'leaks' bullshit. What's the point of killing him now when we know f**** all about him anyway? It would be a whole lot of nothing.
@Kylo Rey

Other interesting quotes by Serkis at the Premiere:

Calls Snoke a great character


He’s driven by this great amount of fear […] This fear is of this great feminine force that’s coming and going to undermine. And of course, leaders who know that they have something to hide, are gonna be brought down.



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Post by ZioRen on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:43 pm

@vaderito wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:To play devil's advocate, leakers like to stick the most shocking or most attention-grabbing things in their first leak. So other story elements and character motivations fall to the side and aren't mentioned, even if they play a crucial part or put the actions in a whole new context. Like "Kylo killing Han Solo in pure cold blood" before TFA.
@ZioRen

it still doesn't justify not a peep about Finn/Rose and Poe/Holdo plots. That's because they don't have enough theories to get ideas from. That is also why they prefer AMA. people rarely ask about anything outside of basic plot points and most popular characters, so they have an easy job.
@vaderito

It does if they feel like nobody would care enough about what happens in those plots to be clamoring for it in a leak. And considering most people see this as the Luke show, it's not exactly wrong to think that. Most people are in for the Force plot and that's where most of the shockers occur. These leaks I've seen only really detail Reylo and Luke ending stuff, since that's what was asked for and has the hype behind it. I've seen leaks that ended up being real presented the exact same way at first. Then later, someone who isn't a jerk fills in the rest.

Also guys, if you're counting me among those "freaking out", please don't.  Laughing  This is the most interesting and widespread "leak" we have right now and it's intriguing to discuss it. Passes the time until we get some completely trustworthy info, anyways.


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Post by californiagirl on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:44 pm

As someone who is completely new to spoilers, does anyone know why most of these spoiler people have such poor grammar, capitalization, punctuation, spelling, etc.? It honestly doesn't help anyone's case, nor make anybody look legitimate. Perhaps some are not native English-speakers? I was surprised at the levels of literacy of this fandom, so maybe I just have unrealistic expectations for everyone else?
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Post by Ynqve on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:45 pm

@snufkin wrote:@Ynqve The core group of forum members here (and others who've come and gone) have consistently been ahead of the curve for nearly two years now when it comes to figuring out the characters, stories, and themes primarily through analysis and discussion here. We've also tended to be people who've seen Rian Johnson's previous films and television work prior to his being announced as writer/director. Nearly everything that's come out in the trailers, posters, collateral materials, and interviews/quotes from the filmmakers and cast has yet to contradict this. It's why the people from here who started podcasts (and why wasn't LF/Disney reaching out to them for advance screenings versus random people on Tumblr and Reddit) have followings and respect. It's why we've always had a lot of lurkers here, reading the discussions. We don't need to freak out over unverified information from elsewhere, especially when it blatantly contradicts what the cast members and filmmakers have said about themes and characters. If people on Tumblr and Reddit want to engage in hysteria and nonsense (which sad to say, people do that sh*t on social media anyways and it leads to things like f*cked up election results and people not vaccinating their kids and causing rubella outbreaks) - let them do that elsewhere. That's not why most of us have been here from the beginning and it's not anything which is going to make anybody here feel better versus taking a breath and just being patient a little longer.
@snufkin

All of this is precisely why I finally decided to join in. This place is an oasis of sanity in a desert of panic and misinformation.
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Post by MyOnlyHope on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:47 pm

IT'S FAF BEYOND WORDS. The person who fabricated this sith didn't even bother reading through the confirmed spoilers we already have from the VD and the picture books. No mention of raw power or Rey and Kylo's intertwined destiny. No mention of the Prime Jedi mosaic or the Lanai. No mention of the Mirror Cave in which Rey experiences her past. No mention of the Force bond. No mention of Kylo and Luke's backtory. No proper description of the Guard fight. No story in general. Luke is cut off from the Force yet somehow Yoda talks to him early on in the movie. People are just latching on to this because there were no legitimate leaks and it's all that's available.


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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:47 pm

@teltaru wrote:
@Ynqve wrote:
@teltaru wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
There are zero signs pointing to Luke becoming a flipping hologram and fighting Kylo across space being true. The problem is everything has become a mess of various fanfictions combined with reaction interpretations.
@FrolickingFizzgig

I didn't want to mention the leaked twitter convo for reasons, but here we go. Seems very much like it was a real conversation, the asker's account was hacked, she's super pissed about it on twitter. The contents of that convo fit into the Luke dies leak perfectly, from junk people to Kylo and Rey having fun together and eventually separating, "possibly for good". Well yeah, if Kylo's crushing Rey's people on Crait that's a fair assumption. As I said, I'm remaining cautious, but that DM makes me uneasy.
@teltaru

But it doesn't. That convo never mentions anything about anyone apart from Kylo, Snoke and Rey. Luke could be doing a million different things in that scenario.
@Ynqve

Ok, but don't you find it curious that everything mentioned in that convo is exactly how it plays out in the "leak" as well?
@teltaru
The leak says Kylo is "super evil" at the end. That doesn't sound the same as the Twitter conversation, does it? Now, this could be a case of fanboy bias and the ending will not be so harsh. I would absolutely be willing to buy that.

No mention of Snoke or Luke dying whatsoever in Joanna's conversation.

There was not a single "sad" reaction over Luke's supposed death on Twitter or anywhere else. Everybody was praising the "humanity" in the film and describing how inspiriting, funny, heartwarming it was -- even saying that it left them with a smile on their face. Many who watched it said Rey and Kylo's relationship was the best part of the movie. That it was angsty and tempestuous.

The only thing that actually lines up is Rey's parents = junkers.


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Post by Piper Maru on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:50 pm

You know. I'll bite.

I liked the FAF leak -- the one from the DMs, no the Reddit bullshit. You know why? Because it's emotional, congruent with the characters presented to us and leaves a lot of open doors for Episode IX.

The best thing is that the real deal is going to be way better.


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Post by vaderito on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:50 pm

@MyOnlyHope wrote:IT'S FAF BEYOND WORDS. The person who fabricated this sith didn't even bother reading through the confirmed spoilers we already have from the VD and the picture books. No mention of raw power or Rey and Kylo's intertwined destiny. No mention of the Prime Jedi mosaic or the Lanai. No mention of the Mirror Cave in which Rey experiences her past. No mention of the Force bond. No mention of Kylo and Luke's backtory. No proper description of the Guard fight. No story in general. Luke is cut off from the Force yet somehow Yoda talks to him early on in the movie. People are just latching on to this because there were no legitimate leaks and it's all that was available.
@MyOnlyHope

Exactly. Alos, because it has eeeeeevil Kylo and Powah Puff Luke Saving the day while everyone else just stand around like planks of wood. I mean, screw RAWPOWAH when you can't project yourself across the galaxy. Speaking off, isn't Reylo connection through the force a thing that transcends space and connects them across the galaxy? Yes it is. Someone randomly picked up parts of VD and made up a stupid plot.
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Post by Ynqve on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 5:57 pm

@RosiePancake wrote:I have to admit that at this point, i'm kind of giving up on getting a real leak. Congratulation Disney, you have succeeded in protecting TLJ's plot at all costs Claps lol!
@RosiePancake

It's amazing how well they've managed to plug any leaks. HBO should take notes and use them for GOT.
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Post by snufkin on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:00 pm

@nite0wl29 @Ynqve

I've been channeling my inner Tim Gunn reading all of this bullshit

Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors - Page 6 Giphy10

We're not Reddit or Tumblr. Or even typical SW fan communities --  that's the reason why we've had better luck (and better ideas) about where the ST is headed. There's no easy shortcut to getting the answers the way 'spoilers' and 'leaks' promise. We just did our homework, that's all. People, go read the press interview comments like the NYT article. Or what Kathleen Kennedy has said. Or the Japanese interviews where they're very direct about the dynamic and relationship. Those are vetted and direct from the people who made this film. Trust that over your fears or biases.

As for speculation, I'll only hazard a guess based on Domhall Gleeson's comments that we see the internal power politics and struggles between Hux, Snoke, and Kylo in this movie which is more complicated than just Renprener. He likely will drop the we should rule the galaxy together line on Rey (who just wants some therapy and a decent meal). But that's a f**king cliche in itself by now after 2 trilogies, people expect that. Reddit's had a f**king boner for Kylo killing Snoke and taking over for almost 2 years now - that outta be a clue right there. It's going to be more ugly and complicated. And whatever Ben got involved with via Luke which led to his fall and plotting against his Master is going to be more complicated than wanting to be Prom King and Prom Queen of the Galaxy.
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Post by snufkin on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:05 pm

@Piper Maru I mean it wouldn't be completely out of the realm of possibility if it's a situation like this at the end of the movie. And the overarching theme of both trilogies is about having to choose between love or power. That's what Snoke has been holding over Ben's head and how he forced him into klling Han. It also sounds like it's what will set up Rey as a very credible threat to his agenda/control when it comes to Ben.



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Post by vinventure12 on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:05 pm

Jediwhinetrick posted her spoilers. Has anyone seen them?
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:06 pm

@vinventure12 wrote:Jediwhinetrick posted her spoilers. Has anyone seen them?
@vinventure12
Same FAF we already saw. Obviously someone saw it and anon messaged her several times in order to appear legit. They've been doing this to her all week and she just keeps biting.
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Post by vinventure12 on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:08 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@vinventure12 wrote:Jediwhinetrick posted her spoilers. Has anyone seen them?
@vinventure12
Same FAF we already saw. Obviously someone saw it and anon messaged her several times in order to appear legit. They've been doing this to her all week and she just keeps biting.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Yeah, I was very surprised it was the same stuff we've been seeing and that she believes the people she is getting the info from.
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:10 pm

@vinventure12 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@vinventure12 wrote:Jediwhinetrick posted her spoilers. Has anyone seen them?
@vinventure12
Same FAF we already saw. Obviously someone saw it and anon messaged her several times in order to appear legit. They've been doing this to her all week and she just keeps biting.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Yeah, I was very surprised it was the same stuff we've been seeing and that she believes the people she is getting the info from.
@vinventure12
Based on watching her "leak" stuff this week she believes everything as long as she gets more than one anon. People are messing with her, unfortunately. Possibly "person" -- singular.
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Post by MyOnlyHope on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:11 pm

@vinventure12 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@vinventure12 wrote:Jediwhinetrick posted her spoilers. Has anyone seen them?
@vinventure12
Same FAF we already saw. Obviously someone saw it and anon messaged her several times in order to appear legit. They've been doing this to her all week and she just keeps biting.
@FrolickingFizzgig
Yeah, I was very surprised it was the same stuff we've been seeing and that she believes the people she is getting the info from.
@vinventure12
She seems to believe anybody who sends her an anon message. It's unbelievable. Rolling Eyes
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Post by Ynqve on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:13 pm

@snufkin wrote:@nite0wl29 @Ynqve

I've been channeling my inner Tim Gunn reading all of this bullshit

Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors - Page 6 Giphy10

We're not Reddit or Tumblr. Or even typical SW fan communities --  that's the reason why we've had better luck (and better ideas) about where the ST is headed. There's no easy shortcut to getting the answers the way 'spoilers' and 'leaks' promise. We just did our homework, that's all. People, go read the press interview comments like the NYT article. Or what Kathleen Kennedy has said. Or the Japanese interviews where they're very direct about the dynamic and relationship. Those are vetted and direct from the people who made this film. Trust that over your fears or biases.

As for speculation, I'll only hazard a guess based on Domhall Gleeson's comments that we see the internal power politics and struggles between Hux, Snoke, and Kylo in this movie which is more complicated than just Renprener. He likely will drop the we should rule the galaxy together line on Rey (who just wants some therapy and a decent meal). But that's a f**king cliche in itself by now after 2 trilogies, people expect that. Reddit's had a f**king boner for Kylo killing Snoke and taking over for almost 2 years now - that outta be a clue right there. It's going to be more ugly and complicated. And whatever Ben got involved with via Luke which led to his fall and plotting against his Master is going to be more complicated than wanting to be Prom King and Prom Queen of the Galaxy.
@snufkin

In all the FAF hysteria I actually forgot about the Prime Jedi Ying Yang stuff. Whatever's going on with Luke and Kylo, it is probably going to play a significant role. So unless the long "this is the entire movie" leaks start mentioning that stuff, I'm just going to automatically discard it as FAF.
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Post by benorganasolo on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:20 pm

What's weird is that Jediwhinetrick's spoilers sound pretty much the same as RPF's spoilers. Luke becoming 'one with the force' on Ahch-to and Kylo overthrowing Snoke to become Supreme Leader lol.
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Post by Piper Maru on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:22 pm

@snufkin

Now I'm imagining Rey and Kylo at the prom. Someone please write a fic!
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Post by Sacrebleu on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:26 pm

@snufkin wrote:@Piper Maru I mean it wouldn't be completely out of the realm of possibility if it's a situation like this at the end of the movie. And the overarching theme of both trilogies is about having to choose between love or power. That's what Snoke has been holding over Ben's head and how he forced him into klling Han. It also sounds like it's what will set up Rey as a very credible threat to his agenda/control when it comes to Ben.

@snufkin

BTW, I finally watched that film yesterday.  Your clips the other day inspired me.
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Post by bashfulblueeyes3 on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:26 pm

Tumblr is making my head ache. I don't know why I bother to look there. I am not anymore. Every time I go on there is new leaks. Nothing I have seen has matched any of the reactions from the people who actually saw the movie. I haven't seen anyone say they cried buckets of tears or there was terrible heartbreak. As a matter of fact, I have saw a few disgruntled people make some snide Reylo comments, like they were together at the end of the movie. You can tell they are not fans, so I don't think they would make anything up. I haven't seen anything in terms of spoilers on Twitter. Everyone is so tight lipped. I think all these so called leaks are ALL FAF.

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Post by snufkin on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:30 pm

@Ynqve Exactly! I've been wondering if

Spoiler:
Snoke's whole gambit is that he's ancient and possibly the first sentient Force user. Which means if the raw power both Ben and Rey display is something only he's seen and is familiar with because it has re-appeared for the first time since ancient history. It'd explain how Luke was out of his depth trying to train Ben because it's a completely different type of FS set of capabilities and powers versus what he and Leia (and even their father) had. It'd also explain his looking for relics, Force Lore, and the 1st Temple. But when things go to sh*t when Leia is backstabbed/outed as Vader's daughter, Ben has whatever happened at Uncle Luke's Bible Camp, and turns to Snoke because supposedly only he understands these powers and knows how to use it. Except that he's clearly been stringing Ben along for at least 5 years now with incomplete training and Han's smart enough from his life as a smuggler to know when you're in a situation where making a deal with the Devil will end up killing you. Hence the warning to Ben which is mentioned in the VD. Ben stays there because he has some purpose thanks to the ancient powers and whatever he discovered as Luke's student to think it's for a higher power/greater good. Except that Snoke's holding back information and has his own agenda too. Which is where Rey figures in - she has this power too. Which is why Ben is drawn to her and clearly wants to win her over in their interactions. The push-pull between them will be Light Dark and choose your destiny (selfish or selfless) - but only she can likely reach Ben having that same power and being able to understand what it feels like to be on your own w/nobody to understand or support you. Including your family. It may turn out that's exactly how they've set up her parents - that they left her as a servant with Plutt because her powers frightened them. So she was an abandoned child, literally another piece of garbage discarded on Jakku. But those two points should set up right away the inline between these two characters. It also sets up how she becomes a very credible threat to Snoke, who has his own agenda. And like Han, she's already had a lifetime of dealing with criminals and knows how to handle/negotiate her way around them.

@Piper Maru - Somebody joked here once about the ST being like Pretty in Pink in Space. Which come to think of it, the discussions about who Rey "should" be with, the whole point of Harry Dean Stanton's character (and his advice to Duckie) was that more harm can come from a woman who commits herself to a man she doesn't love because he loves her/he's a good person instead of being true to her self. It's why the mother/wife abandoned the family and ultimately why Andie goes to Blaine at the end. You're right though - Hux is totally the Steph character in that scenario.

@sacrebleu - you should check out his first film, Sin Nombre, which I think will turn out to be thematically very close to the ST. And goes without saying he directed the brilliant first season of True Detective.  I can see if the two characters come to some type of allied situation and emotional understanding, she'll tell him that he's going down a path she can't follow and they separate. My film nerd dream scenario would be if they discuss Jakku and what he did to LST's village with her "your point, their village" and "yes, I saw a piece of your manhood" to him





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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:31 pm

@benorganasolo wrote:What's weird is that Jediwhinetrick's spoilers sound pretty much the same as RPF's spoilers. Luke becoming 'one with the force' on Ahch-to and Kylo overthrowing Snoke to become Supreme Leader lol.
@benorganasolo
It's not weird at all. That particular leak has been spreading like wildfire since early this morning because it's the only one. Doesn't mean it's not complete BS.
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Post by Ynqve on Sun 10 Dec 2017, 6:33 pm

I keep coming back to reactions where they say that the saga has been changed forever and that some decisions are bold and will be controversial in the fandom.

I don't think this has anything to do with the characters themselves. I think the character motivations are going to be pretty clear and simple to understand. It makes more sense that it has something to do with the mythology of the Force. Kylo becoming Vader 2.0 wouldn't change the saga. Changing the mythology of the Force and the Jedi however? Hmmm that would make hardcore EU fanboys very angry and it could change how we perceive a lot of the canon stuff.
Ynqve
Ynqve
Jedi Padawan
Jedi Padawan

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Date d'inscription : 2017-12-09

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