TLJ: Favourite Scenes

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Kessel on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 8:48 pm

@snufkin wrote:I LOL'd during the confrontation between Luke and Ben where Ben's all "I'LL DESTROY HER!!!!" and Luke's response is "No, you won't." Which besides the fact that Luke realizes Ben's entire rage fest is because of her, she beat both of their asses.

Also, the entire Battle of Crait was an ugly family get together where Ben shows up pissed because he just got dumped and his girlfriend's cut him off and made the choice instead to take sides with his mother in the dispute he has with her. Except that he shows up on the lawn drunk, yelling, and spoiling for fight (but just embarrassing himself) when his uncle comes out and makes him look even more like a jacka** while mom and ex-girlfriend bail to go someplace more quiet. Meanwhile, you have these armies on both sides standing there completely terrified and mortified at what they're having to witness.
@snufkin

Lol! Your analogy of that scenario made me laugh so hard.

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by snufkin on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 9:08 pm

@Kessel I saw Ladybird a couple weeks ago and damn, both films are full of ugly confrontations between kids and their parents expectations of them. Ben taking over and f**king up the FO's assault on Crait is 100% fueled by his anger at his mother/uncle and Rey breaking up with him.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Kessel on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 9:13 pm

@snufkin wrote:@Kessel I saw Ladybird a couple weeks ago and damn, both films are full of ugly confrontations between kids and their parents expectations of them. Ben taking over and f**king up the FO's assault on Crait is 100% fueled by his anger at his mother/uncle and Rey breaking up with him.
@snufkin

Oh definitely. You could see it with him yelling at them to shoot "that piece of junk" out of the sky and ordering the attackers to shoot every single gun at Luke. He was extremely angry and hurt. It was completely personal. It was almost uncomfortable to watch.

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Cowgirlsamurai on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 9:23 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I'll make a full list soon but for now I'll just say that I genuinely loved Luke vs. Ben, from Luke's promise to Leia to Luke also fulfilling Rose's words with Kylo. By giving his life to stall his nephew he simultaneosly protected what he loved in his sister and the remaining Resistance but also Ben by stopping him from doing something else he would regret, something that would have destroyed all hope. It was an intervention of sorts. Kylo was in such a fit of rage that no softer approach would have made a difference. He was not there to save his soul, but he did prevent further fracturing in his own way. Stopping Kylo gave everybody another chance, Ben included.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Thanks for your take on this. I loved that scene, but I was so mad at Luke for appearing to not care or do anything to help Ben there.

And bwahahaha at @snufkin ‘s family get together on Crait!

Sorry for a boring answer, but all of the Kylo scenes were my fave. I adored Adam’s line delivery and facial expressions above everything else. “Blow that piece of junk OUT of the sky.” And, “You’re still...HOLDING ON! LET GO!” were great. Also, how does Adam do that eye twitch? I saw it several times throughout.

- Getting “shot”, the hallway slide, the awkward hand pull back, etc. in the first Force bond
- Wiping the water off his face in the rain one. Also “You do? Oh...you do.”
- How gentle yet eager he is during the hand Force sex
- His terrified eyes in the flashback
- When he’s staring ahead in the elevator, but his eyes snap to her so fast when she says, “Ben.”
- The daggers he stares at Snoke when he says he connected them
- HIP THRUST with Rey on his back during the fight, and his look of desperation when he sees her get slashed
- “Please!” and the whole proposal (damn it sounded good to me... but yeah.)
- Force choking and throwing Hux to control him, also the look Kylo shoots him when Hux repeats one of his commands
- “I’m sure you are!” and the whole Luke confrontation, plus the “Noooo!” at the end
- The way he shudders when Rey shuts the Falcon door
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 9:51 pm

@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by rey09 on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 10:33 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by DeeBee on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 10:35 pm

Whooo great thread idea!

Top five off the top of my head:
-Smut Hut [He took off his glove!!!!]
-Rey calling him 'Ben'
-Rose's line about saving those you love awhhhhh....
-The moment on Crait when Kylo yells an order at the officers, and Hux standing right next to him then immediately yells the exact same order- Deadpan Kylo just turns and looks at him. ROFLMAO!!! It was very dry.. and I hope once Kylo gets off his emotional rampage in IX we'll see more of that side of his character!
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Kessel on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 10:38 pm

@rey09 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
@rey09

Did he see a vision of a dark future when he looked in Ben's mind? I don't remember that. My impression was he just saw darkness and Snoke's influence.

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by rey09 on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 10:40 pm

@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
@rey09

Did he see a vision of a dark future when he looked in Ben's mind? I don't remember that. My impression was he just saw darkness and Snoke's influence.
@Kessel Luke said something about how he saw and i'm paraphrasing ben would bring destruction chaos etc and that's why he wanted to kill him for that quick second- to prevent all that.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by reylodownlo on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 10:48 pm

I need to watch it a second time, but so far:

Leia hologram - definitely cried
All the reylo scenes were so satisfying - Him sliding on the floor during (I think) their first session, Hands touching, The elevator, when he was suppose to execute her, the fighting, the mr. darcy proposal, the dice
i loved adam driver in this role so much - esp. at the end when we was losing it everywhere BRING THAT SHIP DOWN, shooting luke
Adam and Daisy's chemistry was so so good. they nailed the heck out of it.
Leia and Luke's final meeting - also cried
Kylo killing snoke and Rey catching the saber. The way they look for each other in battle
Kylo and Hux's new dynamic
Amilyn Holdo sacrificing herself (I read princess of alderaan and was excited to see her character....she was more normal in the movie)
Paige's death
The parallel between glove and no glove
The fact that kylo didn't mind that she called him Ben


alot of people are holding on to his phrase of "ill destroy her too" I'm not sure I took it as him killing her, just as him bringing her from the light, ending the light/dark, etc. or maybe he's just that unhinged from being rejected and is acting like a maniac

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Kessel on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 10:50 pm

@rey09 wrote:
@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
@rey09

Did he see a vision of a dark future when he looked in Ben's mind? I don't remember that. My impression was he just saw darkness and Snoke's influence.
@Kessel Luke said something about how he saw and i'm paraphrasing ben would bring destruction chaos etc and that's why he wanted to kill him for that quick second- to prevent all that.
@rey09

Ah, ok. I see. Well, that's kind of happened already. Ben has already caused plenty of chaos as Kylo Ren.

Luke also said no one is ever truly gone so he must know deep down that not all is lost with Ben, although he knows he (Luke) can't save him.

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by rey09 on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 11:04 pm

@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
@rey09

Did he see a vision of a dark future when he looked in Ben's mind? I don't remember that. My impression was he just saw darkness and Snoke's influence.
@Kessel Luke said something about how he saw and i'm paraphrasing ben would bring destruction chaos etc and that's why he wanted to kill him for that quick second- to prevent all that.
@rey09

Ah, ok. I see. Well, that's kind of happened already. Ben has already caused plenty of chaos as Kylo Ren.

Luke also said no one is ever truly gone so he must know deep down that not all is lost with Ben, although he knows he (Luke) can't save him.
@Kessel I wish I actually saw him contemplating this for like even a second, because the whole movie he sung a different tune. Like even if he knows it's not his role to play, his delivery was just so cold.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by ZioRen on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 11:31 pm

@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
@rey09

Did he see a vision of a dark future when he looked in Ben's mind? I don't remember that. My impression was he just saw darkness and Snoke's influence.
@Kessel Luke said something about how he saw and i'm paraphrasing ben would bring destruction chaos etc and that's why he wanted to kill him for that quick second- to prevent all that.
@rey09

Ah, ok. I see. Well, that's kind of happened already. Ben has already caused plenty of chaos as Kylo Ren.

Luke also said no one is ever truly gone so he must know deep down that not all is lost with Ben, although he knows he (Luke) can't save him.
@Kessel

That's the point. The tragic irony of it is that Luke saw a vision of the future his own actions would shape. I think the strong implication is that if Luke had taken a different path, Ben probably would have too. It was a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 11:36 pm

@ZioRen wrote:
@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
@rey09

Did he see a vision of a dark future when he looked in Ben's mind? I don't remember that. My impression was he just saw darkness and Snoke's influence.
@Kessel Luke said something about how he saw and i'm paraphrasing ben would bring destruction chaos etc and that's why he wanted to kill him for that quick second- to prevent all that.
@rey09

Ah, ok. I see. Well, that's kind of happened already. Ben has already caused plenty of chaos as Kylo Ren.

Luke also said no one is ever truly gone so he must know deep down that not all is lost with Ben, although he knows he (Luke) can't save him.
@Kessel

That's the point. The tragic irony of it is that Luke saw a vision of the future his own actions would shape. I think the strong implication is that if Luke had taken a different path, Ben probably would have too. It was a self-fulfilling prophecy.
@ZioRen

Star Wars likes to do that a lot.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by snufkin on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 11:40 pm

Oh the self-fulfilling prophecy was Snoke ordering Ben to kill Han as a test to prepare for killing his equal in the Light. Because that moment with Han nearly destroys him, Han demonstrates love and forgiveness, and when it turns out that his equal is Rey - Hell no is he going to make the same mistake twice. Things go pear-shaped afterwards, but Han's sacrifice 100% undermined Snoke's plans and saved Rey's life.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 11:48 pm

@snufkin wrote:Oh the self-fulfilling prophecy was Snoke ordering Ben to kill Han as a test to prepare for killing his equal in the Light. Because that moment with Han nearly destroys him, Han demonstrates love and forgiveness, and when it turns out that his equal is Rey - Hell no is he going to make the same mistake twice. Things go pear-shaped afterwards, but Han's sacrifice 100% undermined Snoke's plans and saved Rey's life.
@snufkin

Yes!  I love how well that was done. There were a ton of issues with continuity/dropped foreshadowing between TFA and TLJ, but I thought Rian did very well following up the "Han test" with "completing Kylo's training".

ETA: I was kind of surprised that Snoke never said anything (because...it would be too obvious?), but I also got the sense that Snoke knew that if Rey lived, she and Ben were destined to be each others' soulmates.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Kessel on Sat 16 Dec 2017, 11:54 pm

@rey09 wrote:
@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@Kessel wrote:
@rey09 wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:@Cowgirlsamurai
Of course he cares about Ben. I don't agree with the interpretation that he has just given up on him. He reassures Leia and admits his failure to Kylo. He helped him in his own way, by ensuring that his attention remained on him, saving the Resistance and the light in Ben. He knows what's going to go down, but hoping someone will change just because you want them to will never work. Ben has to genuinely want to change, and Luke knows he will. It just wasn't the time, but thanks to Luke's sacrifice he became part of the Force and will be able to impact things in ways he never could as a living being.
@FrolickingFizzgig I just don't get where anywhere in the movie we can get to that conclusion. When he also mentions the jedi will rise after him with rey, it's even a bigger blow to kylo. Luke saw a dark future for kylo so now we are supposed to think he saw another vision off camera...?
@rey09

Did he see a vision of a dark future when he looked in Ben's mind? I don't remember that. My impression was he just saw darkness and Snoke's influence.
@Kessel Luke said something about how he saw and i'm paraphrasing ben would bring destruction chaos etc and that's why he wanted to kill him for that quick second- to prevent all that.
@rey09

Ah, ok. I see. Well, that's kind of happened already. Ben has already caused plenty of chaos as Kylo Ren.

Luke also said no one is ever truly gone so he must know deep down that not all is lost with Ben, although he knows he (Luke) can't save him.
@Kessel I wish I actually saw him contemplating this for like even a second, because the whole movie he sung a different tune. Like even if he knows it's not his role to play, his delivery was just so cold.
@rey09

Yeah, I know what you mean. But perhaps he realized after Rey said that Ben could still come back (since she had a bond with him) that it was still possible. Who knows..

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by reylodownlo on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 12:13 am

"Shoot that piece of junk out of the sky" was so comical for me. Here he is dumped, pissed as h*ll, trying to get revenge and here's one more thing to rub Crait salt in his wound. He doesn't care who's piloting it, it's just like a parade of his failures.

#handsex is the new boatsex

All I could think while watching Reylo happen right in front of me:
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by LadyHa on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 12:16 am

I love the 2nd force bond scene.  They connect when they are in a similar stance watching rain/falling sparks. When Ben approaches Rey, I think of this as when his telepathic seduction begins in earnest. His deep voice, her confused look.  Afterwards, wiping the water from his face happens so fast I missed it the first time, but is intriguing - someone on this forum (?) suggested the water on his glove was a bit sexual, which works for me as an interpretation.

But, all of the Ben/Rey scenes are my favorites, so I'll pick a few different ones:

- Yoda, especially when he is giggling
- Luke's ascension - the music was very moving and it was a very satisfying end to his story
- Hux side-eyeing Kylo (well, this is multiple scenes)
- the few seconds of nuns on Ahch-To
- Kylo & Luke's showdown - the actors' expressions and postures are great against the salty & fiery background.  It's somehow ironic that, even as a kid, I found Mark Hamill's acting in the OT a bit unconvincing compared to his co-stars.  In contrast, he really shone in TLJ and transcended that fan service/cameo feel that I got from Carrie & Harrison.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by ZioRen on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 12:19 am

@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@snufkin wrote:Oh the self-fulfilling prophecy was Snoke ordering Ben to kill Han as a test to prepare for killing his equal in the Light. Because that moment with Han nearly destroys him, Han demonstrates love and forgiveness, and when it turns out that his equal is Rey - Hell no is he going to make the same mistake twice. Things go pear-shaped afterwards, but Han's sacrifice 100% undermined Snoke's plans and saved Rey's life.
@snufkin

Yes!  I love how well that was done. There were a ton of issues with continuity/dropped foreshadowing between TFA and TLJ, but I thought Rian did very well following up the "Han test" with "completing Kylo's training".

ETA: I was kind of surprised that Snoke never said anything (because...it would be too obvious?), but I also got the sense that Snoke knew that if Rey lived, she and Ben were destined to be each others' soulmates.
@ISeeAnIsland

It's Andy Serkis' comments that make me think this is definitely correct. He was saying that Snoke was afraid of the growing female force in the galaxy, which he saw as threatening to undermine all the work he'd done. This can be in reference to nobody but Rey. Snoke no doubt knew that if Rey lived, Kylo would eventually be drawn much stronger into her orbit than his. 

In fact, underestimating just how right he was about that was his downfall!
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by snufkin on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 12:32 am

@ZioRen wrote:
@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@snufkin wrote:Oh the self-fulfilling prophecy was Snoke ordering Ben to kill Han as a test to prepare for killing his equal in the Light. Because that moment with Han nearly destroys him, Han demonstrates love and forgiveness, and when it turns out that his equal is Rey - Hell no is he going to make the same mistake twice. Things go pear-shaped afterwards, but Han's sacrifice 100% undermined Snoke's plans and saved Rey's life.
@snufkin

Yes!  I love how well that was done. There were a ton of issues with continuity/dropped foreshadowing between TFA and TLJ, but I thought Rian did very well following up the "Han test" with "completing Kylo's training".

ETA: I was kind of surprised that Snoke never said anything (because...it would be too obvious?), but I also got the sense that Snoke knew that if Rey lived, she and Ben were destined to be each others' soulmates.
@ISeeAnIsland

It's Andy Serkis' comments that make me think this is definitely correct. He was saying that Snoke was afraid of the growing female force in the galaxy, which he saw as threatening to undermine all the work he'd done. This can be in reference to nobody but Rey. Snoke no doubt knew that if Rey lived, Kylo would eventually be drawn much stronger into her orbit than his. 

In fact, underestimating just how right he was about that was his downfall!

@ZioRen

Oh for sure, it sounded like his original belief was that Luke was the equal in the Light, hence the test of killing a family member by starting with Han. Which Jesus, poor Han. Dude got picked as warm-up and all of Snoke's snide comments about "too much of your father's heart in you." Like @ISeeanIsland said, RJ may have looked at TFA's script and thought to Hell with following through with the obvious plot points set up like who Snoke is (turns out he's just a rich old DS a**hole who gets off on power and manipulating people). But he at least carried through that particular thread and came up with all the explanation needed. Snoke knew that there would be an equal in the Light, for a long time he thought it was Luke hence the orders to find the map/kill him, and killing Han was the test. He obviously also used Han's character (too much heart, weak and foolish) and likely criminal/lower class origins as taunts against Ben. Which ugh, rubbed off on him when he offers his hand to Rey.

The other thread which looks like it got answered was the line "When Skywalker returns, the new Jedi will arise." Which Luke did and hence we get the boy with the broom (everybody's favorite!), meaning that the end of the traditional Jedi order doesn't mean the end of the Force or people who follow that path.

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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by ZioRen on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 12:45 am

@snufkin

What I find funny about that is Kylo would probably have a MUCH easier time killing Luke conscience-wise than he would Han, considering their messed up backstory. If anything, emotionally speaking, killing Luke should have been the test for killing Han.  Laughing
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Lily Snape on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 12:56 am

@snufkin wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@snufkin wrote:Oh the self-fulfilling prophecy was Snoke ordering Ben to kill Han as a test to prepare for killing his equal in the Light. Because that moment with Han nearly destroys him, Han demonstrates love and forgiveness, and when it turns out that his equal is Rey - Hell no is he going to make the same mistake twice. Things go pear-shaped afterwards, but Han's sacrifice 100% undermined Snoke's plans and saved Rey's life.
@snufkin

Yes!  I love how well that was done. There were a ton of issues with continuity/dropped foreshadowing between TFA and TLJ, but I thought Rian did very well following up the "Han test" with "completing Kylo's training".

ETA: I was kind of surprised that Snoke never said anything (because...it would be too obvious?), but I also got the sense that Snoke knew that if Rey lived, she and Ben were destined to be each others' soulmates.
@ISeeAnIsland

It's Andy Serkis' comments that make me think this is definitely correct. He was saying that Snoke was afraid of the growing female force in the galaxy, which he saw as threatening to undermine all the work he'd done. This can be in reference to nobody but Rey. Snoke no doubt knew that if Rey lived, Kylo would eventually be drawn much stronger into her orbit than his. 

In fact, underestimating just how right he was about that was his downfall!

@ZioRen

Oh for sure, it sounded like his original belief was that Luke was the equal in the Light, hence the test of killing a family member by starting with Han. Which Jesus, poor Han. Dude got picked as warm-up and all of Snoke's snide comments about "too much of your father's heart in you." Like @ISeeanIsland said, RJ may have looked at TFA's script and thought to Hell with following through with the obvious plot points set up like who Snoke is (turns out he's just a rich old DS a**hole who gets off on power and manipulating people). But he at least carried through that particular thread and came up with all the explanation needed. Snoke knew that there would be an equal in the Light, for a long time he thought it was Luke hence the orders to find the map/kill him, and killing Han was the test. He obviously also used Han's character (too much heart, weak and foolish) and likely criminal/lower class origins as taunts against Ben. Which ugh, rubbed off on him when he offers his hand to Rey.

The other thread which looks like it got answered was the line "When Skywalker returns, the new Jedi will arise." Which Luke did and hence we get the boy with the broom (everybody's favorite!), meaning that the end of the traditional Jedi order doesn't mean the end of the Force or people who follow that path.

@snufkin

Unlike some others, I didn't mind the boy with the broom.  I know we already got the point with Rey (or heck, with Anakin) that Force-sensitivity can rise from the most downtrodden places.  But I thought it gave a bit of hope for these poor slave kids, that one of their number might be able to get them out at some point, and also with the decimation of the resistance and the end of Luke, it's kind of nice to feel like the Force is arising out there somewhere.  It's a hopeful end to a fairly dark film.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by snufkin on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 1:29 am

@Lily Snape NO! I would be chasing that goddamn adorable moppet with a broom and telling him to get back to the salt mines.
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Re: TLJ: Favourite Scenes

Post by Darth_Awakened on Sun 17 Dec 2017, 1:58 am

@vaderito wrote:All Reylo scenes were fantastic:

#Handsex

#PowahDuo

#P&P

#Heartbreak

#Beefcake

#RainDrop

#Elevator

Did I forget anything?

Other favorite scenes:

Rey feels the Force  lol!

"Shoot that piece of junk out of the sky!" (most useful line ever, I'm gonna apply it a lot)

"More! More!"

Kylo faces Luke. He's so pretty. Deranged, sweaty Kylo is always my favorite.

"take that ridiculous thing off" Snoke tells it like it is. RIP. It's like losing Hef twice. Sad Sad Sad

Holdo cruiser's lightspeed jump. A thing of beauty.
@vaderito

Yesterday during my second viewing I thought that was your spirit that possessed Rian while writing that line.

lol!
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