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Post by MyOnlyHope on Mon 12 Feb - 0:48

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Post by Riri on Mon 12 Feb - 1:58

Super interesting video essay that got retweeted by Pablo, it explores the cultural and cinematic impact of SW. Its fascinating ESB recieved mixed reviews for exactly the same reasons we're seeing today with TLJ. Have people not learned from their mistakes when they were in denial about Lukes heritage. Ha!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?t=1182s&v=Ij5fWCAnBPY


Last edited by Riri on Mon 12 Feb - 2:00; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Riri on Mon 12 Feb - 1:59

@MyOnlyHope Thanks thats great! That is the flaw of the Jedi!

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Post by KnightsofReylo_2015 on Mon 12 Feb - 2:49

@Riri wrote:Super interesting video essay that got retweeted by Pablo, it explores the cultural and cinematic impact of SW. Its fascinating ESB recieved mixed reviews for exactly the same reasons we're seeing today with TLJ. Have people not learned from their mistakes when they were in denial about Lukes heritage. Ha!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?t=1182s&v=Ij5fWCAnBPY
@Riri

This is great, thanks for posting!!!  I'm watching it now and hearing and all the comments/reviews (both professional and fan) when the OT first came out... I'm thinking wow, you could put them all verbatim into how the the ST has been reviewed (so far).  You could just plug in TLJ wherever he talks about ESB...and there you go!  I liked hearing about the mixed bag of reviews from fans coming out of ESB (mostly becuase their fan theories weren't realized...sound familiar?!)...and that it wasn't the beloved film it is now, until way after RoTJ...when people knew how it ends and were able to appreciate how it pushed the envelope and took the most risks of OT.  So who knows, maybe a few years after IX comes out and we all get over the epic happy ending...(which btw, we ARE getting), TLJ may end up being the fav of the ST...because of all the risks it took....we'll see...
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Post by DeeBee on Mon 12 Feb - 3:57

@MyOnlyHope

thanks for sharing this!!! super exciting to me to hear talk of the Kazerath!!
I'm going to put this in the balance of the force thread and I'll comment more there to those interested in discussing balance Smile

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Post by SoloSideCousin on Mon 12 Feb - 6:44

@MyOnlyHope

Wow. Just Wow! There is a lot going on in this exchange.

He says that no normal being could balance the dark and light in themselves.

So does that hint that Mr. "Focal point of dark and light" might be in that Bendu category of specialness,  and if he is, then shouldn't his equal in the force be that special as well?

Also, he says that one person could not handle the balance inside of them ---though he doesn't answer the Prime Jedi question very clearly, but putting that aside for a moment --- he doesn't say that *two* people couldn't balance the force.

Also, if Rey and Ben can't balance the dark and light inside them despite their power, could a child of theirs do it?

Whatever the case, the implications of the early part of the exchange, at the very least, do not rule out Rey and Kylo as being a kind of Adam and Eve.

But most importantly, Matt doesn't deny that the force is both light and dark, nor does he deny that everyone has the dark in them. This is a change in attitude from the OT/PT view of the dark side being this outside evil, like it's an attacking cancer.

Then the tweeter comments that fear and anger are natural emotions and that suppressing them doesn't sound too harmonious.

And to these three sentences, Matt answers and "therein lies the flaw of the Jedi."

Wow. We talked about just this issue in the Adam and Eve podcast. We talked about how anger and fear were not inherently evil. Certainly those feelings are corruptive if they overwhelm everything else, but I think if they are kept in check and don't go past a certain large minority position, that they are fine and a real part of life.  

The dark is the shadow side everyone has. If you suppress it, it comes back inconveniently and tragically and fighting mad, like Luke almost killing Ben. But if you accept it and acknowledge that it is a part of you, then the fear of it dies, and it's that fear that provides the fuel to let that darkness go out if control.

@meadowofashes, @Vaderito, please jump in if you think I am interpreting this light/dark thing wrong in the yin and yang or the Jungian sense.
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Post by Darth_Awakened on Mon 12 Feb - 9:45

If I'am not mistaken this tweet is the first example that someone "official" has spoken aloud and coherent about the heart of the Jedi flaws.

The supressing the dark side aka the supressing the natural emotions: fear, anger, passion, and ultimately as the AOTC promo poster says love (attachement), led to the fall of the Jedi Order.

And when Luke says at the end of TLJ that he wouldn't be the last Jedi - he definitely doesn't have in mind the Jedi as in old Jedi Counil sense.


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Post by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 10:37

A couple of screenshot from Pablos account, this is my first time posting pics. So not sure this will work! My rolling screen shot wasn't working so doing these separately.
If anyone else can get a continuous shot please do, as Pablo's twitter deletes itself.

Just posting to see if it's worked.

edit    No!!!! Bah humbug. No idea what to do. the servimg image hosting doesn't work for me, every time time I try, it throws out jackpot wins in a virus type way. So tried another image hosting, it came up as a pic in the preview, but not actual post. So I'm going to find Pablos thread. Link and hopefully someone else will catch it.


Last edited by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 10:56; edited 2 times in total
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Post by Teo oswald on Mon 12 Feb - 10:43

if we look at Star wars it
communicates deep thematic message: opposites, darkness and light, good agains evil, Rebell and First Order, revenge and forgiveness must coexist in balance in order to create harmony in the galaxy.
every being has both light and darkness ,  Kylo infact  is unable to find equilibrium he needs someone to help him.



However, Rey and kylo represent the two sides of the force regardless of whether there is light and darkness within them.
and it is precisely for this reason that the two seem prophetic, they are destined to bring balance to the galaxy.

Moreover, Rey is tied to Kylo without knowing it, is linked to the Skywalker / Solo family, before she realized it.
and then we know that Rey will form a new order of Jedi, in her teachings she will surely speak of light and darkness and of coexistence between them.
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Post by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 10:53

https://mobile.twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/962875218514518016

This comment by Pablo caught my eye
"Villains don’t end well in Star Wars, which has as one of its core tenets that villains are cowards."


And someone tweeted below " If this means Kylo Ren is doomed, I'll be very depressed. Sad"

Then an hour later Pablo posted this
https://mobile.twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/962914148517494785

Lots of other comments in between, but I just found it interesting,  in what makes a SW villain, and to me, we have an interesting take on Kylo, and what a villain means. I don't regard Kylo as a coward, not in the sense of what I think a coward is, but he definitely has fears.
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Post by Darth_Awakened on Mon 12 Feb - 11:07

@Let The Past Die wrote:A couple of screenshot from Pablos account, this is my first time posting pics. So not sure this will work! My rolling screen shot wasn't working so doing these separately.
If anyone else can get a continuous shot please do, as Pablo's twitter deletes itself.

Just posting to see if it's worked.

edit    No!!!! Bah humbug. No idea what to do. the servimg image hosting doesn't work for me, every time time I try, it throws out jackpot wins in a virus type way. So tried another image hosting, it came up as a pic in the preview, but not actual post. So I'm going to find Pablos thread. Link and hopefully someone else will catch it.
@Let The Past Die

I've been struggling with the posting of screenshots for two years. Until some "thing" called "One Cloud" appeared as a part of my Windows.
I'am using the "cloud" as the place where I save the screenshot and then when it's saved I can edit it and the whatever I want with it.

Don't ask me too much about because I pretty much s***k at this stuff.


As for Pablo and his musings about the SW villains - nothing new really.
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Post by Night Huntress on Mon 12 Feb - 11:09

@Let The Past Die

I don't see Kylo as a SW- Villain... the Villain was Snoke till TLJ and he is dead.

Will Kylo be the Villain in IX? I don't think so... and loosing his power could also mean loosing his position as Supreme Leader. Which wouldn't be a bad thing.

And by the way... never take what Pablo tweets or says to literally - ever Wink
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Post by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 11:18

@Darth_Awakened wrote:
@Let The Past Die wrote:A couple of screenshot from Pablos account, this is my first time posting pics. So not sure this will work! My rolling screen shot wasn't working so doing these separately.
If anyone else can get a continuous shot please do, as Pablo's twitter deletes itself.

Just posting to see if it's worked.

edit    No!!!! Bah humbug. No idea what to do. the servimg image hosting doesn't work for me, every time time I try,  it throws out jackpot wins in a virus type way. So tried another image hosting, it came up as a pic in the preview, but not actual post. So I'm going to find Pablos thread. Link and hopefully someone else will catch it.
@Let The Past Die

I've been struggling with the posting of screenshots for two years. Until some "thing" called "One Cloud" appeared as a part of my Windows.
I'am using the "cloud" as the place where I save the screenshot and then when it's saved I can edit it and the whatever I want with it.

Don't ask me too much about because I pretty much s***k at this stuff.


[ As for Pablo and his musings about the SW villains - nothing new really.

@Darth_Awakened

I see, it's new to me... Lol
I just found the whole conversation interesting  but if its old news nevermind, I seem to drag up oldstuff all the time Shocked sorry about that.

Thanks for trying to help regarding pictures, Thumbs up I use my phone mostly when I log on here. I'm losing the will to live  trying to post pictures. I need to find an appropriate image hosting site, that doesn't try to scam me.  Since I'm normally late to the party, think I'll leave it to others.
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Post by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 11:20

@Night Huntress wrote:@Let The Past Die

I don't see Kylo as a SW- Villain... the Villain was Snoke till TLJ and he is dead.

Will Kylo be the Villain in IX? I don't think so... and loosing his power could also mean loosing his position as Supreme Leader. Which wouldn't be a bad thing.

And by the way... never take what Pablo tweets or says to literally - ever Wink
@Night Huntress

I agree, I take your view. Thumbs up Just found it interesting reading others comments around it.
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Post by SoloSideCousin on Mon 12 Feb - 11:30

@Let The Past Die wrote:https://mobile.twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/962875218514518016

This comment by Pablo caught my eye
"Villains don’t end well in Star Wars, which has as one of its core tenets that villains are cowards."


And someone tweeted below " If this means Kylo Ren is doomed, I'll be very depressed. Sad"

Then an hour later Pablo posted this
https://mobile.twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/962914148517494785

Lots of other comments in between, but I just found it interesting,  in what makes a SW villain, and to me, we have an interesting take on Kylo, and what a villain means. I don't regard Kylo as a coward, not in the sense of what I think a coward is, but he definitely has fears.
@Let The Past Die

Pablo has very particular and pretty narrow views on villains.  He likes the Jabbas and Palpatine types.  He has never been a big Kylo fan as a result.  I think at one point he actually said that he didn't like an "anti-hero type of villain." I am paraphrasing from memory, but that was the gist of it.  He likes things black and white when it comes to villains.  Kylo doesn't fit that mold.

That being said, the dude just posted a picture of Anakin and Palpatine where Palpatine says "the only thing he was afraid of was ... losing his power."  In the end, that is prophetic for Anakin.  He starts off afraid he's going to lose Padme, but it turns out power is his true love.

TLJ, OTOH, ending with penitent, kneeling, crying Kylo, has already shown that Kylo's greatest fear is not losing his power.  His devastation is all about losing Rey.
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Post by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 11:48

@SoloSideCousin wrote: TLJ, OTOH, ending with penitent, kneeling, crying Kylo, has already shown that Kylo's greatest fear is not losing his power. His devastation is all about losing Rey.
@SoloSideCousin

The above quote, my thoughts exactly!

*sighs* it's hard keeping up with what's what when a relative newbie, (it feels like I've been here forever, but it's only a month... Lol) but I'll take everyone's advice regarding Pablo's comments. Thanks Thumbs up
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Post by Darth_Awakened on Mon 12 Feb - 12:11

@Let The Past Die wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:
@Let The Past Die wrote:A couple of screenshot from Pablos account, this is my first time posting pics. So not sure this will work! My rolling screen shot wasn't working so doing these separately.
If anyone else can get a continuous shot please do, as Pablo's twitter deletes itself.

Just posting to see if it's worked.

edit    No!!!! Bah humbug. No idea what to do. the servimg image hosting doesn't work for me, every time time I try,  it throws out jackpot wins in a virus type way. So tried another image hosting, it came up as a pic in the preview, but not actual post. So I'm going to find Pablos thread. Link and hopefully someone else will catch it.
@Let The Past Die

I've been struggling with the posting of screenshots for two years. Until some "thing" called "One Cloud" appeared as a part of my Windows.
I'am using the "cloud" as the place where I save the screenshot and then when it's saved I can edit it and the whatever I want with it.

Don't ask me too much about because I pretty much s***k at this stuff.


[ As for Pablo and his musings about the SW villains - nothing new really.

@Darth_Awakened

I see, it's new to me... Lol
I just found the whole conversation interesting  but if its old news nevermind, I seem to drag up oldstuff all the time Shocked sorry about that.

Thanks for trying to help regarding pictures, Thumbs up I use my phone mostly when I log on here. I'm losing the will to live  trying to post pictures. I need to find an appropriate image hosting site, that doesn't try to scam me.  Since I'm normally late to the party, think I'll leave it to others.
@Let The Past Die

Oh no worries and no need to excuse yourself Smile

Just post away whatever you like - I have zero problems with it.

I was just referring to Pablo's "traditional" view on SW villains which in past somehow always triggered "a disturbance" in the Force on this forum.

As for pictures and the phone: I have NO idea how to do it while on the phone.
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Post by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 12:36

@RosiePancake

I remember that on twitter, there seemed to be a meltdown over it. I don't get the panic. I find the conversations interesting, but not to go into panic mode. I guess this is part of what to expect remember the timeline thread I posted http://reylo.skyforum.net/t759-timeline-of-what-can-we-expect-to-see-from-now-until-december-2019

The older members advised that we would see that kind of panic.... Hold onto the rollecoaster lol!

I do like reading through comments though, just to get others perspectives.
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Post by Let The Past Die on Mon 12 Feb - 13:33

@RosiePancake wrote:
@Let The Past Die wrote:@RosiePancake

I remember that on twitter, there seemed to be a meltdown over it. I don't get the panic. I find the conversations interesting, but not to go into panic mode. I guess this is part of what to expect remember the timeline thread I posted http://reylo.skyforum.net/t759-timeline-of-what-can-we-expect-to-see-from-now-until-december-2019

The older members advised that we would see that kind of panic.... Hold onto the rollecoaster lol!

I do like reading through comments though, just to get others perspectives.
@Let The Past Die

I see. I understand why some fans are starting to panic about Kylo's fate. Even my friends react the same too. It always happens when you're too attracted to someone, hehe, and Kylo isn't a one-dimensional typical protagonist like Rey, Finn, Poe with thick plot armor that you don't have to worry about. Sometimes I joke with my friends (they also like Kylo a lot) that maybe Adam should tell JJ to not killing him (if JJ ever thinks about it) like how Oscar did it with JJ.
@RosiePancake

Don't get me wrong, if anything happened to Kylo's character that I didn't like I'd be gutted. He's such a multilayered character, I feel quite invested in him. I read on another thread about a month ago, one of the members here said to trust the narrative. And so I am. If it goes belly up in IX, its because the narrative gets ignored, but why deviate what's set up in the 2 previous films.

So between now and actually watching IX, I'm not going to stress about it, I'm just enjoying reading everyone's views here. The only stress I will have, is whether to go into the film spoiler free or not. But that won't happen until nearer the film comes out.
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Post by Riri on Mon 12 Feb - 14:28

Guys do not worry about Kylos fate. Remember the SW saga is all about hope, redemption and second chances. The 9-part story wont end in tragedy. If it did then i don't think most people could bear to watch the OT and PT again knowing the Skywalker family was always cursed, it would be such a depressing feeling. JJ said he likes happy endings (paraphrasing).

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Post by Dar-ren19 on Mon 12 Feb - 14:38

Yes that’s my hope. JJ is a hopeful, optimistic guy. He’s also a romantic. He gave Spock a real romance in the movies.
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Post by EchoBase on Mon 12 Feb - 16:38

Discussions: Tweets/Instagram - Page 38 788dcd10

Via https://twitter.com/sleemo_/status/963061903156269057

Look at his face on that little screen I love you
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