Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by giaciak2 on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 6:04 am

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:Reposting from another thread:

It's always been about story structure for me so ending VIII with Renperor is the best possible thing that could have happened for endgame Reylo. It's a means of dragging the conflict along, focusing the heart of the narrative's drama on Rey and Kylo and most importantly postponing resolution for the end. Not the middle, as would have been the case with any Ronin Rey and Kylo scenario. The actual end.

Upset Annes are never going to realize it but Rey and Kylo failing to find unity or achieve any resolution at the end of the second of three films (and after defining their romantic connection thoroughly) makes endgame Reylo 110% inevitable. Ben Solo's soul and reciprocated Reylo are the goals of this three act story, not pit stops along the way to defeating Snoke. Interestingly that's why TLJ sort of has a "fillery" feel in some parts -- that's kind of what it is. It focuses on the evolution of Rey and Kylo's romantic dynamic without resolving anything, and intentionally so. It provides us with the perfect minimalist foundation for a star-crossed lovers trajectory, deals with Kylo's backstory, humanizes him to the max and sets up a completely electric, forbidden and tragic conflict all amping us up for the final clash of ideologies and lightsabers.

Structurally Reylo actually follows a romance slated for a happy ending or at least an optimistic and satisfying resolution, a.k.a. the most basic romance structure ever and the one found in all romantic comedies: Laughing



And here is Rian Johnson's quote from People Magazine this week when asked "how he feels about being the chief architect behind a potentially devastating romantic tragedy."
“Well I’ll say the two characters and how they [interact], like in The Force Awakens, the interrogation scene, that was one of the most intriguing scenes to me both on the page and when I saw the scene that J.J. [Abrams] created. So I think he set up this very interesting dynamic. And then to get to play with it in this movie and now, to get to hand it back to J.J. and see how it gets resolved, I’m really, really excited to see what happens.”

And an addition... I don't have a whole lot of experience "shipping", but my education is in English lit (I focused on children's lit) and my track record for predicting the direction narrative character dynamics will take is pretty spotless. All I can say is I have developed very good instincts and I trust them. Reylo was just another checkmark on a very long list for me because the trajectory was always painfully clear. It was just a question of how it would get there and what kind of redemption/love story it would be.
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What you wrote is too good. when I will be depressed, I will read what you have written here. Cry
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by Asphodel on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 6:23 am

@FrolickingFizzgig your message just gave me hope !
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by lauvamp on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 7:26 am

@giaciak2 @Asphodel @FrolickingFizzgig

Same here Sad I love you really appreciated!
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by MyOnlyHope on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 8:29 am

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:Reposting from another thread:

It's always been about story structure for me so ending VIII with Renperor is the best possible thing that could have happened for endgame Reylo. It's a means of dragging the conflict along, focusing the heart of the narrative's drama on Rey and Kylo and most importantly postponing resolution for the end. Not the middle, as would have been the case with any Ronin Rey and Kylo scenario. The actual end.

Upset Annes are never going to realize it but Rey and Kylo failing to find unity or achieve any resolution at the end of the second of three films (and after defining their romantic connection thoroughly) makes endgame Reylo 110% inevitable. Ben Solo's soul and reciprocated Reylo are the goals of this three act story, not pit stops along the way to defeating Snoke. Interestingly that's why TLJ sort of has a "fillery" feel in some parts -- that's kind of what it is. It focuses on the evolution of Rey and Kylo's romantic dynamic without resolving anything, and intentionally so. It provides us with the perfect minimalist foundation for a star-crossed lovers trajectory, deals with Kylo's backstory, humanizes him to the max and sets up a completely electric, forbidden and tragic conflict all amping us up for the final clash of ideologies and lightsabers.

Structurally Reylo actually follows a romance slated for a happy ending or at least an optimistic and satisfying resolution, a.k.a. the most basic romance structure ever and the one found in all romantic comedies: Laughing



And here is Rian Johnson's quote from People Magazine this week when asked "how he feels about being the chief architect behind a potentially devastating romantic tragedy."
“Well I’ll say the two characters and how they [interact], like in The Force Awakens, the interrogation scene, that was one of the most intriguing scenes to me both on the page and when I saw the scene that J.J. [Abrams] created. So I think he set up this very interesting dynamic. And then to get to play with it in this movie and now, to get to hand it back to J.J. and see how it gets resolved, I’m really, really excited to see what happens.”

And an addition... I don't have a whole lot of experience "shipping", but my education is in English lit (I focused on children's lit) and my track record for predicting the direction narrative character dynamics will take is pretty spotless. All I can say is I have developed very good instincts and I trust them. Reylo was just another checkmark on a very long list for me because the trajectory was always painfully clear. It was just a question of how it would get there and what kind of redemption/love story it would be.
@FrolickingFizzgig
In support, a quote from Kathleen Kennedy in which she underlines the three act structure that's being followed with the ST.
“There's no question that this is set up as a trilogy, and that three-act structure of the set-up, the conflict, and the resolution very much is what we have planned.”
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by Teo oswald on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 8:48 am

practically Rian launched the bomb by putting our protagonists against again "JJ I broke up Reylo, assemble the pieces" Smile


In this trilogy nothing is as it seems, Rian makes fans believe that in the next episode everything will go to hell, take viewers to the wrong path. It was seen in episode VII, I also fell for it but now I understand. For example, Snoke, everyone believed, me too, who was the real enemy, this led the fans to create theories of him because they thought he would be the bad guy to defeat like Palpatine. But this did not happen. The Star Wars team never said, "you'll find out more about Snoke in the next movie" these were just our theories, that's why Snoke's death was unpredictable. Even the lineage of Rey was predictable, but many fans believed in it and developed theories. This is what Star Wars does, leading people to believe in something. But there are people (like the Reylo fans who are not fooled) have predicted most things, and this is crazy Smile
So if a fan thinks oh no Reylo is dead, or not now Kylo is the enemy, he can not redeem himself, it is wrong because nothing is as it seems in this trilogy. It will still astonish us as it did in previous episodes.

Let the past die, leave the old episodes and face this last episode with different eyes
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by nickandnora on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 9:00 am

Honestly, one of my favourite parts of that three act romance is the separation, easily. So much juicy stuff happens in the separation, so many realizations. My favourite is Jane Eyre (which I think Reylo is being modelled after, heavily) when, a year after Jane leaves Rochester, she hears him calling out to her in his pain and anguish, and she knows she has to return to him, and it's later revealed that he heard her calling out to him too. Something like that is *totally* going to happen to Reylo in IX. I mean... they have a force bond. They can literally tap into each other, lol. It's already built in.

So yeah, separation is good stuff.

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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by SheLitAFire on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 9:29 am

@nickandnora wrote:Honestly, one of my favourite parts of that three act romance is the separation, easily. So much juicy stuff happens in the separation, so many realizations. My favourite is Jane Eyre (which I think Reylo is being modelled after, heavily) when, a year after Jane leaves Rochester, she hears him calling out to her in his pain and anguish, and she knows she has to return to him, and it's later revealed that he heard her calling out to him too. Something like that is *totally* going to happen to Reylo in IX. I mean... they have a force bond. They can literally tap into each other, lol. It's already built in.

So yeah, separation is good stuff.
@nickandnora

There's a SWC podcast about Reylo & literary references, including lots of time dedicated to Jane Eyre, coming out soon! Lolilol
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by IoJovi on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 9:35 am

@MyOnlyHope wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:Reposting from another thread:

It's always been about story structure for me so ending VIII with Renperor is the best possible thing that could have happened for endgame Reylo. It's a means of dragging the conflict along, focusing the heart of the narrative's drama on Rey and Kylo and most importantly postponing resolution for the end. Not the middle, as would have been the case with any Ronin Rey and Kylo scenario. The actual end.

Upset Annes are never going to realize it but Rey and Kylo failing to find unity or achieve any resolution at the end of the second of three films (and after defining their romantic connection thoroughly) makes endgame Reylo 110% inevitable. Ben Solo's soul and reciprocated Reylo are the goals of this three act story, not pit stops along the way to defeating Snoke. Interestingly that's why TLJ sort of has a "fillery" feel in some parts -- that's kind of what it is. It focuses on the evolution of Rey and Kylo's romantic dynamic without resolving anything, and intentionally so. It provides us with the perfect minimalist foundation for a star-crossed lovers trajectory, deals with Kylo's backstory, humanizes him to the max and sets up a completely electric, forbidden and tragic conflict all amping us up for the final clash of ideologies and lightsabers.

Structurally Reylo actually follows a romance slated for a happy ending or at least an optimistic and satisfying resolution, a.k.a. the most basic romance structure ever and the one found in all romantic comedies: Laughing



And here is Rian Johnson's quote from People Magazine this week when asked "how he feels about being the chief architect behind a potentially devastating romantic tragedy."
“Well I’ll say the two characters and how they [interact], like in The Force Awakens, the interrogation scene, that was one of the most intriguing scenes to me both on the page and when I saw the scene that J.J. [Abrams] created. So I think he set up this very interesting dynamic. And then to get to play with it in this movie and now, to get to hand it back to J.J. and see how it gets resolved, I’m really, really excited to see what happens.”

And an addition... I don't have a whole lot of experience "shipping", but my education is in English lit (I focused on children's lit) and my track record for predicting the direction narrative character dynamics will take is pretty spotless. All I can say is I have developed very good instincts and I trust them. Reylo was just another checkmark on a very long list for me because the trajectory was always painfully clear. It was just a question of how it would get there and what kind of redemption/love story it would be.
@FrolickingFizzgig
In support, a quote from Kathleen Kennedy in which she underlines the three act structure that's being followed with the ST.
“There's no question that this is set up as a trilogy, and that three-act structure of the set-up, the conflict, and the resolution very much is what we have planned.”
@MyOnlyHope


This post literally made me giddy when I read it.  Thanks for making my freaking day!!! cheers cheers cheers  

I also get excited whenever I see the episode IX emblem in blue (as opposed to TLJ's red, the trilogies darkest hour).  I can't wait for that resolution.
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 9:37 am

@nickandnora wrote:Honestly, one of my favourite parts of that three act romance is the separation, easily. So much juicy stuff happens in the separation, so many realizations. My favourite is Jane Eyre (which I think Reylo is being modelled after, heavily) when, a year after Jane leaves Rochester, she hears him calling out to her in his pain and anguish, and she knows she has to return to him, and it's later revealed that he heard her calling out to him too. Something like that is *totally* going to happen to Reylo in IX. I mean... they have a force bond. They can literally tap into each other, lol. It's already built in.

So yeah, separation is good stuff.
@nickandnora
@Saracene was laughing about how the ST has a bunch of dudes and fanboys watching what amounts to a romantic drama or period piece in space. It's disguised with lightsabers and blasters and cool ships but they're not fooling us. Laughing

And just a general positive thing here's my favourite quote from Kathleen Kennedy on Kylo's arc:
"One of the most interesting aspects of Kylo Ren is his young age. Much of the time villains are damaged, troubled and much older. Making the new Star Wars villain a 30-year-old man was a captivating choice. We could take advantage of a troubled adolescence and past we know little about. From there we could find his tension between the light and dark that dominates the Star Wars universe. We could use it as a metaphor for the path that leads a young adult to his accomplished adult life."
The whole interview is a good read: http://thehermitsacedia.tumblr.com/post/140041132904/kathleen-kennedy-on-kylo-ren
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by Kylo Rey on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 9:48 am

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@nickandnora wrote:Honestly, one of my favourite parts of that three act romance is the separation, easily. So much juicy stuff happens in the separation, so many realizations. My favourite is Jane Eyre (which I think Reylo is being modelled after, heavily) when, a year after Jane leaves Rochester, she hears him calling out to her in his pain and anguish, and she knows she has to return to him, and it's later revealed that he heard her calling out to him too. Something like that is *totally* going to happen to Reylo in IX. I mean... they have a force bond. They can literally tap into each other, lol. It's already built in.

So yeah, separation is good stuff.
@nickandnora
@Saracene was laughing about how the ST has a bunch of dudes and fanboys watching what amounts to a romantic drama or period piece in space. It's disguised with lightsabers and blasters and cool ships but they're not fooling us. Laughing

And just a general positive thing here's my favourite quote from Kathleen Kennedy on Kylo's arc:
"One of the most interesting aspects of Kylo Ren is his young age. Much of the time villains are damaged, troubled and much older. Making the new Star Wars villain a 30-year-old man was a captivating choice. We could take advantage of a troubled adolescence and past we know little about. From there we could find his tension between the light and dark that dominates the Star Wars universe. We could use it as a metaphor for the path that leads a young adult to his accomplished adult life."
The whole interview is a good read: http://thehermitsacedia.tumblr.com/post/140041132904/kathleen-kennedy-on-kylo-ren
@FrolickingFizzgig

That was me haha. But yeah, the idea of these fanboys watching 'Jane Eyre in Space' is pretty funny. That Kathleen Kennedy interview was so great. That bit about Kylo's bad decisions not necessarily being bad in the context of Star Wars screams redemption. And 'accomplished' adult life is a big clue about his endgame.

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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by ZioRen on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 12:57 pm

@Kylo Rey wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@nickandnora wrote:Honestly, one of my favourite parts of that three act romance is the separation, easily. So much juicy stuff happens in the separation, so many realizations. My favourite is Jane Eyre (which I think Reylo is being modelled after, heavily) when, a year after Jane leaves Rochester, she hears him calling out to her in his pain and anguish, and she knows she has to return to him, and it's later revealed that he heard her calling out to him too. Something like that is *totally* going to happen to Reylo in IX. I mean... they have a force bond. They can literally tap into each other, lol. It's already built in.

So yeah, separation is good stuff.
@nickandnora
@Saracene was laughing about how the ST has a bunch of dudes and fanboys watching what amounts to a romantic drama or period piece in space. It's disguised with lightsabers and blasters and cool ships but they're not fooling us. Laughing

And just a general positive thing here's my favourite quote from Kathleen Kennedy on Kylo's arc:
"One of the most interesting aspects of Kylo Ren is his young age. Much of the time villains are damaged, troubled and much older. Making the new Star Wars villain a 30-year-old man was a captivating choice. We could take advantage of a troubled adolescence and past we know little about. From there we could find his tension between the light and dark that dominates the Star Wars universe. We could use it as a metaphor for the path that leads a young adult to his accomplished adult life."
The whole interview is a good read: http://thehermitsacedia.tumblr.com/post/140041132904/kathleen-kennedy-on-kylo-ren
@FrolickingFizzgig

That was me haha. But yeah, the idea of these fanboys watching 'Jane Eyre in Space' is pretty funny. That Kathleen Kennedy interview was so great. That bit about Kylo's bad decisions not necessarily being bad in the context of Star Wars screams redemption. And 'accomplished' adult life is a big clue about his endgame.

@Kylo Rey

Yup. You can't be an accomplished adult and still immersed in the dark side, as the dark side is all about recklessly indulging the most negative versions of your emotions. Kylo especially embodies this aspect of it. That's about the opposite of maturity and accomplished adulthood.
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 1:04 pm

@ZioRen wrote:
@Kylo Rey wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@nickandnora wrote:Honestly, one of my favourite parts of that three act romance is the separation, easily. So much juicy stuff happens in the separation, so many realizations. My favourite is Jane Eyre (which I think Reylo is being modelled after, heavily) when, a year after Jane leaves Rochester, she hears him calling out to her in his pain and anguish, and she knows she has to return to him, and it's later revealed that he heard her calling out to him too. Something like that is *totally* going to happen to Reylo in IX. I mean... they have a force bond. They can literally tap into each other, lol. It's already built in.

So yeah, separation is good stuff.
@nickandnora
@Saracene was laughing about how the ST has a bunch of dudes and fanboys watching what amounts to a romantic drama or period piece in space. It's disguised with lightsabers and blasters and cool ships but they're not fooling us. Laughing

And just a general positive thing here's my favourite quote from Kathleen Kennedy on Kylo's arc:
"One of the most interesting aspects of Kylo Ren is his young age. Much of the time villains are damaged, troubled and much older. Making the new Star Wars villain a 30-year-old man was a captivating choice. We could take advantage of a troubled adolescence and past we know little about. From there we could find his tension between the light and dark that dominates the Star Wars universe. We could use it as a metaphor for the path that leads a young adult to his accomplished adult life."
The whole interview is a good read: http://thehermitsacedia.tumblr.com/post/140041132904/kathleen-kennedy-on-kylo-ren
@FrolickingFizzgig

That was me haha. But yeah, the idea of these fanboys watching 'Jane Eyre in Space' is pretty funny. That Kathleen Kennedy interview was so great. That bit about Kylo's bad decisions not necessarily being bad in the context of Star Wars screams redemption. And 'accomplished' adult life is a big clue about his endgame.

@Kylo Rey

Yup. You can't be an accomplished adult and still immersed in the dark side, as the dark side is all about recklessly indulging the most negative versions of your emotions. Kylo especially embodies this aspect of it. That's about the opposite of maturity and accomplished adulthood.
@ZioRen
Indeed, Kathleen Kennedy quite literally compares the dark side to adolescence in this interview and goes on to say that Kylo's arc is going to be a metaphor for a young man overcoming that and emerging an accomplished adult.
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by Kessel on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 4:09 pm

Yep, no way “accomplished adult life”=“becomes a unredeemable evil villain who the heroes just have to take out.”

If the dark side is a metaphor for destructive youth and rebellion, the message is not that Kylo is forever lost, unable to return and must be destroyed by the perfect good heroes who never made any mistakes (with lasting consequences) in their lives.

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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by MyOnlyHope on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 5:03 pm

@Kessel wrote:Yep, no way “accomplished adult life”=“becomes a unredeemable evil villain who the heroes just have to take out.”

If the dark side is a metaphor for destructive youth and rebellion, the message is not that Kylo is forever lost, unable to return and must be destroyed by the perfect good heroes who never made any mistakes (with lasting consequences) in their lives.
@Kessel
Totally! And it's also noteworthy that KK makes such a point of differentiating Kylo from other villains, specifically those who are "damaged, troubled and much older." Darth Vader fits that description exactly, "more machine than man," aged and irreparably damaged. In contrast, Kylo Ren's defined by his youth, his strength and his humanity. The point is that he's not like Vader. He's a young, healthy man, not an old, burned up robot who can't even breathe on his own. He's the opposite of too far gone. Why would KK stress what makes Kylo different from villains like Vader who are just that, too far gone, if he was just going to share the same fate? The answer: she obviously wouldn't. They're telling a very different story with Kylo.


Last edited by MyOnlyHope on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 6:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by californiagirl on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 6:10 pm

In support, a quote from Kathleen Kennedy in which she underlines the three act structure that's being followed with the ST.
“There's no question that this is set up as a trilogy, and that three-act structure of the set-up, the conflict, and the resolution very much is what we have planned.”
[/quote]
@MyOnlyHope

Where is this quote from? Heaven forbid there was a concept of a story arc and planning. Here's to hoping they become more open about this in the next movie cycle.
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by MyOnlyHope on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 6:48 pm

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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by californiagirl on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 7:21 pm

@MyOnlyHope

Thank you! I was not here at that point, so I was not as up to date with all the SW news.

It seems as though whenever a nugget like this drops, it's always on a smaller website or magazine, not one of the bigger media platforms.
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by DeeBee on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 4:01 am

The Rebels finale was a good sign (IMHO) for what's ahead for Reylo!!!

Rebels tv finale spoiler & the skywalker saga ending..:
So I haven't seen it yet, but I hear the finale revealed that Hera and now dead Jedi Kanaan had a child. A boy named Jacen (yes Jacen!).
So it seems Hera and Kanaan secretly got busy... Kanaan died - and after his death Hera had their child..

What's this got to do with Reylo? I think this means the idea that Rey and Kylo/Ben get together, then Kylo/Ben dies with Rey living on pregnant with his baby and continuing the skywalker blood line is now toast!


I think if they do it for the Rebels tv show finale, they can't do it for the skywalker saga finale too!!!!!!! I think this is very unlikely... and I'm sooooo happy that this scenario is off the table for Reylo!!! Claps Claps Claps
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by Night Huntress on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 4:29 am

I would really hate it if Ben dies leaving Rey pregnant behind - I truly hope they won't do this.

To be honest- I'm not really worried. That would mean Ben & Rey becoming very intimate very fast in IX...with how TLJ ended?? I Truly doubt that.

AND if they will be Reylo baby I want once in the history of the Skywalkers that he or she will grow up with BOTH parents around and actually raising their kid like a normal functional family! Mad
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Re: Positive Thoughts for IX, the Reylo edition

Post by giaciak2 on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 5:31 am

@Night Huntress wrote:I would really hate it if Ben dies leaving Rey pregnant behind - I truly hope they won't do this.

To be honest- I'm not really worried. That would mean Ben & Rey becoming very intimate very fast in IX...with how TLJ ended?? I Truly doubt that.

AND if they will be Reylo baby I want once in the history of the Skywalkers that he or she will grow up with BOTH parents around and actually raising their kid like a normal functional family! Mad
@"Cacciatrice notturna"

I agree with you. I hope the fact that Rebel ends like this is really the sign that for Rey and Ben could be a better end. However I'm not fond of the books and observations of Star Wars actors and composers, so I'm not so convinced. But if they wanted to be honest with the plot. Ben Solo is the heir of Anakin who can show how the life of Anakin would have gone if he had taken a different path. I hope this is the real story. All story was told by Padme's eyes. As for Anakin, the question is how it would have been if Padme had the strength. What could she do to avoid losing Anakin? I don't think the answer is waiting ... We'll see ...
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