The Rey Kenobi Files

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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by BigDeal2187 on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 12:36 pm

@Kessel

Amen.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by BigDeal2187 on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 12:40 pm

One thing I’m still trying to work through in my mind is why any further reveal or additional information about Rey’s past would be held back for IX given what we learned in VIII.  If there are no answers about Rey’s place in this story from her past, and this apparently is the whole point, then why go back to her past again in the next episode?  Doesn’t make sense.  I mean, maybe they won’t.  Perhaps that’s it, that’s all.

What I would argue, however, is that whatever additional story we get about Rey’s past, it won’t be used to contradict or undo the message we have so far.  I have to admit that wouldn’t make sense.  Any further reveal is either going to be used to solidify it, or it will be used to augment/supplement it.

Based on Rey’s conversation with Luke in the tree it seems that RJ left it rather ambiguous.  Luke asks her where she’s from.  She says nowhere.  Luke says that no one’s from no where.  Rey says Jakku.  [Insert Jakku humour].  So which one is it?  She really is from nowhere?  Or is there more to it because no one’s from nowhere?  Or maybe it’s both.  I dare to speculate only so far.

So in episode 9 the message could be: Yes, you’re a nobody, yes, you have to be your own person, yes, you seemingly have no place in this story, yes, you have to make your own place in this story, yes, you (so far) have no last name, and yes, you have to make a name for yourself ….. but … however …. this isn’t real life for goodness sake, this is effing Star Wars/fantasy/escapism, so here’s why you, Rey Nobody, and not another Rey Nobody, have a connection to this very particular person, Ben Solo, the grandson of Darth Vader.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Acritiqua on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 1:47 pm

Rey and Kylo are linked by how they both believe their families threw them away now. We know Kylo's family didn't throw him away. It may remain that Rey's family didn't throw her away either (there is more to it).

I think it was important to kill this who is Rey related to question as TLJ did. Rey comes to conclude supposedly that it doesn't really matter. This means she can't get trapped in anything regarding her legacy/lineage (as Kylo is). She is free of that now.

So were Rey to discover she is related to Obi-Wan in IX she would be able to take this information in stride because it's not who she is related to, who her parents were, etc. It is who SHE is. Rey knows that now.

The person who didn't learn the truth about his family in this movie is Kylo. Everything he believes is a lie from Snoke. When LST told him in TFA that he can't forget the truth that is his family, Kylo is like "you're so right" (as in he blames them for everything and believes they threw him away).

IX could be the movie in which both Rey and Kylo learn the actual *truth* that is each of their families. It would make sense that neither of them know it in TLJ because they must remain connected on this.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Little_Boots on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 2:16 pm

In my opinion Kylo slaughtered any Rey Parentage theory with his "you're nobody but not to me" speech.
Bens family are accepting of Rey and so is he! Belonging is ahead not behind.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Acritiqua on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 2:23 pm

And no matter if it's permanently slaughtered or not, I'm glad TLJ slaughtered it. It's such a relief to be able to see the story without the "mystery" of Rey's family and who they were. Even if she turns out to be related to Obi-Wan, now the focus is on her front and center. Any reveal like that would be the equivalent of Leia turning out to be a Skywalker. By that point everything that matters with Leia and her relationships is already there. I actually got a kick out of how thoroughly TLJ trampled down so many theories.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Gemini on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 2:44 pm

@reylo1992 wrote:
@Gemini wrote:And this is a loony theory but

The trailer suggests that when snoke first found ben /turned ben he saw kylos power yada yada and then saw something truly special beyond that.. Cut to rey. This line is also in the movie

When snoke got his claws in ben,  Rey would have been 5.. Just around the time of abandonment

If snoke has been aware of rey since 5 years old,  could he have been manipulating her mind since childhood too?

Reylo have always been connected from before snoke found ben and snoke has always been manipulating them since he got his claws in ben?  Because what she is shown in the saber vision is not the same as her own memories.

Killing snoke like this may be another ploy to throw you off the scent.  And he actually did have a much bigger role in all this

Snoke wanted Vader... Well he forgot that Vader also killed his master palpatine. Silly snoke Laughing
@Gemini

Can't agree more about that one Gem Very Happy

I was disappointed in how Rian made Snoke looks so stupid. Serkis told us how great Snoke is, how much he is aware of the past to a great level, etc... It is canon that the guy is completely aware that Vader killed Palpatine because of sentiment, and made exactly the same with Kylo.

Aside from that, it seems that Snoke was aware of "darkness rising and light to meet it". So he was aware that Kylo would be that darkness rising but it doesn't seem like he identified Rey as the light counterpart rising to meet it. Instead, he identified Luke as this light counterpart and it is clear that his intention was to kill him in order to avoid the balance. So it doesn't seem that Rey was meant to play a specific role in his agenda or that he even knew about her existence before he saw Kylo's connection to her. I was also expecting that he could have played a part in her background, i.e. whatever happened to her family, but it doesn't seems like this is the case either.

TLJ wasn't very good in tying things alltogether IMO.

@reylo1992

Remember what he said in tfa

If they find skywalker the new jedi would rise... Well thats Rey. It signifies that he is very aware of her. But never knew her location because of jakku? And the fact things go hidden there like the MF
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by reylo1992 on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 3:05 pm

@Gemini wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@Gemini wrote:And this is a loony theory but

The trailer suggests that when snoke first found ben /turned ben he saw kylos power yada yada and then saw something truly special beyond that.. Cut to rey. This line is also in the movie

When snoke got his claws in ben,  Rey would have been 5.. Just around the time of abandonment

If snoke has been aware of rey since 5 years old,  could he have been manipulating her mind since childhood too?

Reylo have always been connected from before snoke found ben and snoke has always been manipulating them since he got his claws in ben?  Because what she is shown in the saber vision is not the same as her own memories.

Killing snoke like this may be another ploy to throw you off the scent.  And he actually did have a much bigger role in all this

Snoke wanted Vader... Well he forgot that Vader also killed his master palpatine. Silly snoke Laughing
@Gemini

Can't agree more about that one Gem Very Happy

I was disappointed in how Rian made Snoke looks so stupid. Serkis told us how great Snoke is, how much he is aware of the past to a great level, etc... It is canon that the guy is completely aware that Vader killed Palpatine because of sentiment, and made exactly the same with Kylo.

Aside from that, it seems that Snoke was aware of "darkness rising and light to meet it". So he was aware that Kylo would be that darkness rising but it doesn't seem like he identified Rey as the light counterpart rising to meet it. Instead, he identified Luke as this light counterpart and it is clear that his intention was to kill him in order to avoid the balance. So it doesn't seem that Rey was meant to play a specific role in his agenda or that he even knew about her existence before he saw Kylo's connection to her. I was also expecting that he could have played a part in her background, i.e. whatever happened to her family, but it doesn't seems like this is the case either.

TLJ wasn't very good in tying things alltogether IMO.

@reylo1992

Remember what he said in tfa

If they find skywalker the new jedi would rise... Well thats Rey. It signifies that he is very aware of her. But never knew her location because of jakku? And the fact things go hidden there like the MF
@Gemini

Good reminder. He had probably identified her as the awakening but since when, that's a good question.

I think I will need the watch the movie again - in French this time - to confirm my impression but it seems to me he initially thought Luke would be that light counterpart but then realized that it was Rey.

I ask myself what's the deal with Jakku. I hope that J.J. will give some sense to the line "why does everyone wants to go back to Jakku" but who knows what will be in that movie. I was so surprised how Rian handled TLJ so who knows how J.J. will handle "Dark crystal".
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by BigDeal2187 on Wed 20 Dec 2017, 10:08 pm

@Acritiqua wrote:Rey and Kylo are linked by how they both believe their families threw them away now. We know Kylo's family didn't throw him away. It may remain that Rey's family didn't throw her away either (there is more to it).

I think it was important to kill this who is Rey related to question as TLJ did. Rey comes to conclude supposedly that it doesn't really matter. This means she can't get trapped in anything regarding her legacy/lineage (as Kylo is). She is free of that now.

So were Rey to discover she is related to Obi-Wan in IX she would be able to take this information in stride because it's not who she is related to, who her parents were, etc. It is who SHE is. Rey knows that now.

The person who didn't learn the truth about his family in this movie is Kylo. Everything he believes is a lie from Snoke. When LST told him in TFA that he can't forget the truth that is his family, Kylo is like "you're so right" (as in he blames them for everything and believes they threw him away).

IX could be the movie in which both Rey and Kylo learn the actual *truth* that is each of their families. It would make sense that neither of them know it in TLJ because they must remain connected on this.
@Acritiqua

Right, it could be that the mirror didn't show Rey her parents because she wasn't ready or prepared for it yet.  So it showed her what she needed to see instead of what she wanted to see.  She hoped it would give her her place in this story on a silver platter.  But now that she's learned that her belonging is ahead and not behind (and now that the audience has been hit over the head with the message that the force doesn't belong to any one bloodline), only now is Rey emotionally and psychologically prepared to learn the identity of her parents/lineage.  That's a possibility for IX.  Whereas Kylo Ren might finally learn to embrace those parts of his past that he shouldn't be seeking to kill off or let die.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by reylo1992 on Thu 21 Dec 2017, 4:48 pm

Okay, that meta is primarily about Kylo but there is interesting stuff there about the Mandos too. I think it's worth to share it in that thread. Who knows if the Mandos won't be involved in the next Episode, right? @TheBastardofMandalore, do you have any thought about this?
http://reylosource.tumblr.com/post/168799588050/kylo-ren-and-the-holy-war
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by TheBastardofMandalore on Thu 21 Dec 2017, 11:04 pm

@reylo1992 wrote:Okay, that meta is primarily about Kylo but there is interesting stuff there about the Mandos too. I think it's worth to share it in that thread. Who knows if the Mandos won't be involved in the next Episode, right? @TheBastardofMandalore, do you have any thought about this?
http://reylosource.tumblr.com/post/168799588050/kylo-ren-and-the-holy-war
@reylo1992

This is a very interesting meta. There is definitely a space holy war/crusade theme that has been heavily hinted at in the current SW trilogy, Rebels and Battlefront 2. Especially when it comes to relics. The Mandos were an integral part of the ancient wars (which was considered part of the Legends verse until being made canon in the Rebels episode “Trials of the Dark Saber”). If episode 9 continues with that “holy war” theme then it would make sense for the Mandos to be involved. It would tie past and present. Which would, in turn, tie into the conflicting themes between Rey and Kylo. He wants the past to die whereas she clings to it.

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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by fuhry on Fri 22 Dec 2017, 8:22 am

In my headcanon, Rey's parentage reveal is something that helps her accomplish her and Ben's objective of ending the galaxy-wide war. But it doesn't really matter so much to the story. In ANH, Luke gets drawn into the story because he's a Skywalker. He gets recruited by Obi-wan because Obi-wan knows he has the potential to be a Jedi. So Obi-wan convinces him to abandon his Aunt and Uncle and their humble moisture farm.

In TFA, Rey is drawn into the story because she cares about a droid, and she's interested in the resistance and attracted (in some way) to Finn. She's not pulled into it because someone thinks she might be a powerful asset - as Anakin was, as Luke was, and as Ben was. That's a critical difference and I'm glad they made the story that way. I do think it would be poetic if she turned out to be Kenobi's granddaughter, but I think that's more of the cherry on top of the whole story, which works without it.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Gemini on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 6:25 am

@Little_Boots wrote:In my opinion Kylo slaughtered any Rey Parentage theory with his "you're nobody but not to me" speech.
Bens family are accepting of Rey and so is he! Belonging is ahead not behind.
@Little_Boots

That was not a good thing to say to rey,  he says it to weaken her so that she feels worthless and has to lean on him.  Rj confirmed that. What kind of belonging is that?  Where you feel so worthless that you have to lean on someone who is trying to make you feel like crap.

All that line needed to transform it from something so horrible was the word "think" and it would have made it a whole lot more romantic

"You think you're nothing,  but not to me"

Not "you're nothing,  but not to me"

Its an awful, crippling thing to say to someone who already feels like crap about themselves
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by reylo1992 on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 7:23 am

@Gemini wrote:
@Little_Boots wrote:In my opinion Kylo slaughtered any Rey Parentage theory with his "you're nobody but not to me" speech.
Bens family are accepting of Rey and so is he! Belonging is ahead not behind.
@Little_Boots

That was not a good thing to say to rey,  he says it to weaken her so that she feels worthless and has to lean on him.  Rj confirmed that.

All that line needed to transform it from something so horrible was the word "think" and it would have made it a whole lot more romantic

"You think you're nothing,  but not to me"

Not "you're nothing,  but not to me"


Its an awful, crippling thing to say to someone who already feels like crap about themselves
@Gemini

Yep! I agree that Rian could have made it more romantic because that will feed the Antis's discourse that Reylo is abuse for the next two years. If only Rian had indedd added "You think that", that would have made his attitude appear less manipulative


Still I believe that the most important line in his little speech is not this line in particular but the following line:

You have no place in this story

Let's keep in mind this important line at the beginning of the movie:

"I need someone to show me my place in all of this"


She first goes to Luke for answers but Luke doesn't show her at all where her place is. He is only acknowledging that she is drawn to the dark cave - dark side - because she is trying to fill a void in herself: the truth about her parents. Then, she indeed goes to this forbidden place in order to find the answer she is craving for but the mirror doesn't show her anything. Why?

Maybe because of this:

Kylo Ren: "Do you want to know the truth about her parents or have you always known?"

And I think this is interesting that the mirror didn't show her anything, only two shapes that finally merge into one shape that looks incredibly simillar to Kylo. I might be wrong but IMO either the mirror is telling her "the belonging you seek is not behind you, it is ahead (subtext: move on!) or/and he is telling her that only Kylo can force herself to admit what she's always known deep inside her.

Btw, this scene reminds me so much of the mirror scene in Harry Potter. Let's keep in mind what Dumbledore advises Harry after he tells him that the mirror shows the "most desperate desire of our heart":

"However, this mirror will give us neither knowledge or truth. Men have wasted away before it, entranced by what they have seen, or been driven mad, not knowing if what it shows is real or even possible [...]It does not do to dwell on dreams and forget to live, remember that"


Hasn't forgotten to live by clinging to that hope? That's why she is so desperate in the next scene: the mirror didn't show her the answer to her most desperate desire and thus didn't show her her place in all of this. So who is doing that in the end?

Kylo: "You have no place in this story"

IMO, this line in particular is more a message to the audience than to the heroine herself: she has no place in the Skywalker saga determined by her origins. It might sound harsh but Kylo is actually only saying louder what the audience was told from the very beginning:

Maz: Who are you?
Rey: I am no one


And he is also saying louder to Rey what she was already told, forcing her to acknowledge what she's always known deep inside.

Maz: Dear child, I see your eyes, you already know the truth

That may sound harsh but I think there is also some catharsis dimension here, very much the same way Luke pushes Kylo to let all his pain and anger coming out. Of course, Kylo is also selfish here: it is clear that he badly wants her! But I think that he also knows her better than she does: he knows now that this girl has no chance to find her parents, he probably feels that she is not that deep bonded with the Resistance and he doesn't want her to be alone. That was his message to her when she was at her lowest point in the hut: you are not alone. And since she indeed leant on him at her lowest point, he has no reason to think he can't fill that void. I think that both dimensions are mixed in this scene: he selfishly wants her but he genuinely wants to help her too.



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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by ZioRen on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 12:46 pm

The whole point is that Kylo's being a jerk because his head still isn't in the right place. It's a declaration of romantic feelings in many ways, but it's not supposed to be romantic in its whole, which is why people compare it to things like Darcy's first horrible proposal. That's why Rey rightfully rejects him.

But Rian has also said, though this was not mentioned in the complaint post, that Kylo was being genuine when he said those things to Rey and actually thought it was something else that let them relate to each other. Rian said that Kylo's intention was not to manipulate Rey or 'neg' her, but illuminate that "this is something we have in common, so surely you must be seeing things the same way I do, right? Clearly you see now that we only have each other and we should start anew together?" 

I think the thing with the "weaken you and try to make you lean on him" is how Rey was seeing it, because that's what those words were functionally doing to her in that moment. But Kylo was just being blunt and underestimating the amount of love, purpose, and belonging Rey has already found in the likes of Finn and Luke and Leia. It's hard for Kylo to believe or accept that she possibly could have found purpose there, since he despises the Resistance and resents his family so much. And we all know how much Kylo likes to project.  Laughing
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Acritiqua on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 1:06 pm

I can buy that Kylo wants Rey to lean on him because I think it has to do with his unhealthy understanding of relationships. Part of the progression for Kylo's character if there is to be any chance of Reylo is that he has to go from seeking to dominate Rey (pure dark side drive) to fully respecting her as an equal in her own right. In TLJ Kylo seems to have come a bit farther along in this from where we see him in their first meeting. In the first meeting he renders Rey unconscious, so she is "leaning on him" in every way.

However Kylo's dream of Rey joining him began in TFA. It was at the cliff when he offered to teach her that his mind was clearly already considering what they could be like together. In TLJ he believes he is realizing this dream and is in for a rude awakening when Rey... disagrees. How he emerges from her rejection will determine his course. He could do the 1d villain thing and just be mad at Rey and stalk her and try to kill her over and over until she finally kills him in self-defense. But he could do something more interesting and examine why Rey is disappointed in him and what he perhaps didn't understand that led to the complete opposite outcome of what he wanted.

Kylo wanting Rey to lean on him is kind of part of the same attitude problem he has that leads him to say she comes from nothing, she is nothing. I would say his blindness about what Rey actually wants is part of this too except the oddity in this is that Rey seems similarly blind to what Kylo wants. They are both hit in the face with the other's rejection. They connect emotionally but they still don't quite see each other.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 1:13 pm

STaHp aCcUSiNg fICtiOnAL chARaCTeRs oF emoTIoNaL MAnIpULaTIon. fICtiOn iS nOT rEAlITy.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by ZioRen on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 1:21 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:STaHp aCcUSiNg fICtiOnAL chARaCTeRs oF emoTIoNaL MAnIpULaTIon. fICtiOn iS nOT rEAlITy.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Even beyond that, Rian literally said that Kylo wasn't even intending to manipulate her within the confines of the fiction.

And even if you thought it was, there's no reason to be concerned about Rey or Reylo. Rey has already made it very clear that she's not going to tolerate being talked to like that. If Reylo happens, it will be because Kylo has changed his attitude and comes from a place of genuine and selfless love. There's no victimization going on here. There's no concern that "oh but what if Kylo lapses back into being a douche once they're finally together? Poor Rey!" because they're not real people. 

Equating it to a real life jerk in a relationship is a pointless endeavor. Kylo doesn't really have any agency; everything he does is a written out and planned thing. If they write him and Rey into a good and loving relationship, that's that. It's useless and ridiculous to worry about a fictional character's future possible thoughts and actions past the ending of a story because they literally don't exist. If the narrative and writers ever tell you that Kylo has changed for the better, there's no reason to question it or worry about it being true like a real life person. Because he's not real.


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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 1:23 pm

@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:STaHp aCcUSiNg fICtiOnAL chARaCTeRs oF emoTIoNaL MAnIpULaTIon. fICtiOn iS nOT rEAlITy.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Even beyond that, Rian literally said that Kylo wasn't even intending to manipulate her within the confines of the fiction.
@ZioRen
Of course he wasn't. That's such a simplistic read of the situation. Totally based in an inability to separate real life from fiction.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Acritiqua on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 2:00 pm

I'm not sure if the way I view it is as an emotional manipulation or not. Even if one goes off of what RJ said, that's not really clear since he said both that Kylo wants Rey to lean on him and that he's not intending the parentage reveal as something he can use on her to manipulate her. Both things are true.

I see Kylo as telling the truth when he says, "You come from nothing. You're nothing. But not to me." He is saying it exactly how he perceives it. But the way he's making the offer feels a little less like ruling as equals and more that he will take her in. She will in a way, be under his power. He still isn't quite viewing them as equals, though he has moved beyond "just a scavenger."

So it's not that he says "you're nothing" as an intended put down to make her feel like nothing. But the way in which he is offering her a place - with him - isn't very empowering to her. She is nothing, with no place in this story. He believes that. And when I look at it from that point of view (his point of view), wanting Rey to join him is wanting her to lean on him.  He wants her to belong to him. And that is from the dark side.

I believe also though there is the part of Kylo who is in awe of Rey. Though I suppose that part of him is all Ben Solo. But the part of him that is Kylo wouldn't allow him to say something like, "I think you're amazing" instead of "You're nothing, but not to me." And part of it is that he has an elitist attitude. Between this scene and "You. A scavenger" I can really see someone with this privileged elitist perspective but who was raised liberal since he isn't actually trying to put Rey down but trying to find the right etiquette in talking to the little people, or something. I don't believe he means to offend her. He is just an a** since he doesn't think of how hurtful saying "you're nothing" to someone is.

And his offer is still intertwined with the sentiment when he told her "you're not alone" in the hut. That sentiment is what will make the pain of Rey's rejection (as he will perceive it) sting all the more. Even if he comes around by the end of the next movie, I can easily imagine him beginning the movie in a rage. I hope that perhaps during the time gap he will have thought about his behavior and not begin the film wanting to kill Rey.


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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by Saracene on Sun 24 Dec 2017, 2:07 pm

Another small detail I picked up on rewatch is that Kylo's "say the brutal truth out loud already" in the throne room is the second time he does it to Rey. In their earlier conversation Rey can't bring herself to ask him why he killed Han, and Kylo is like, go on finish your question and say it like it is.

But of course some people will insist that he's lying about Rey's parents because hey, he's the villain.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by BigDeal2187 on Sat 30 Dec 2017, 9:20 pm

So while I think the Rey Kenobi train has left the station, I still see a way for them to work it into the ST, even though I don't think it's going to happen anymore. But I need to get this off my chest.

Perhaps the "parents" who sold Rey for drinking money weren't her biological parents and they used some of the money from selling her as a slave for passage off Jakku (hence the ship in Rey's vision). Perhaps her biological parents died when she was young (and the helmet we see Rey wear at the beginning of TFA belonged to one of them even though she doesn't know it). Whatever way they might reveal it in episode 9, they'd have to come at it from the point of view that the Kenobi bloodline/lineage isn't one of significance, that it's not where her power comes from.  Were Obi-Wan's parents Jedi? And if one of Rey's biological parents was a Kenobi but not a force user, could it really be argued that the Kenobi bloodline is of any importance? Like the mighty Skywalker bloodline?

Obi-Wan himself is a legend, but his life was in many ways a life of tragedy. He lost Anakin and Satine. He spent 19 years living in a desert as a nobody, often trading "junk" with Jawas. His life was thrown out like garbage, until one day he would give the saber to Luke (who didn't want to take up his calling until he saw that his "family" was killed and therefore had no more belonging on that "nowhere" planet). Obi-Wan's place in the Skywalker story wasn't given to him on a silver platter. And he had to deal with tempermental Skywalkers, after all, just as Rey is now.

So while everyone, including Rey, expects the next hero/legend to be a Skywalker, whether Luke (Rey offers the saber to Luke a 2nd time) or Ben Solo ("then he's our last hope"), the surprise is that the hero this time won't come from the "mighty Skywalker blood." The hero will come from an ordinary lineage: Kenobi ("Help me Obi-Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope").

And what does Luke say to Rey about Vader? "It was a Jedi who was responsible for the training and creation of Darth Vader" - referring to Obi-Wan Kenobi of course.  And Rey's respone: "And it was a Jedi who saved him" - referring to Luke Skywalker.  But who was responsible for the training and creation of Kylo Ren? And who, as we all know, is going to help redeem him? So the twist could be that this time the role will be reversed and the Kenobi will be the one to help save him, and the story brought full circle in this way.

So this, I think, would be how they'd have to work it into the story if they're still going to reveal Rey as the granddaughter of Obi-Wan. And now that Rey has been confronted with her fear in the cave ("I never felt so alone"), now that Rey knows her belonging is ahead and not behind, and now that Rey is taking up her own place in this story, perhaps now she's ready for some good news about her family that will strengthen her for her journey, just as Luke discovered in act 3 (in ROTJ he learned that he had a sister). And the surprise that Obi-Wan had a child would be an interesting way to introduce into episode 9 the topic of the Jedi approach to love and attachment, which is exactly where the story of Ben and Rey is going.

So to me this is all poetic and beautiful and wonderful, but even I have to admit I don't see this happening anymore. Episode 9 would have to be engineered in such a way to make all of this more clear to the audience, and in such a way as to demonstrate that this was the intent from the beginning.

But I just don't think it's going to happen anymore.  It's too late in the game, and it's fairly clear that RJ is asking us to see Rey more broadly than just as a Kenobi.  It would distract from the Rey-Padme parallels we've seen, which I believe will become more prominent in episode 9.  And last, but not least, I think too many in the GA would incorrectly conclude that because Rey is a Kenobi that this is why she's so powerful in the force.

So while I wholeheartedly agree with the message that the force is egalitarian and that Jedi/force users can come from any place or bloodline or station in life, and while I absolutely love TLJ, I'll always despise the idea that Rey was chosen by the force at random for a very specific purpose in a story with a very specific history.  It seems that Colin Trevorrow's statement about the answer to Rey's backstory being deeply and profoundly satisfying got fired along with Trevorrow.  But I'm making my peace with it because I just don't believe anymore that Rey is a Kenobi.

Anyways, had to get this off my chest.  Cheers everyone.
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by fuhry on Sun 31 Dec 2017, 5:43 pm

@BigDeal2187

I always liked the Rey Kenobi idea, and I thought it could be possible that Obi-wan fathered a child while on Tatooine. But I never believed in it until I saw the Clone Wars Duchess Satine story arc - because it seemed that we were being set up for descendants of Kenobi to possibly pop up in future stories.

That said, the Satine/Korkie thing was created by George Lucas who may or may not have been in negotiations with Disney at that point. George obviously likes these types of familial connections, and this could easily be something that was thrown out along with a lot of other George ideas.

Given the TLJ story, occurring mere days after the events of TFA, there's really no space or narrative necessity for a parentage reveal. Whether it was set up as an intentional mystery box in TFA (I think so) or it just happened that way because fans expected that kind of connection, I think it's completely understandable that Rian didn't make a big deal out of it. Except, he kind of did make a big deal out of it by emphasizing her lack of familial connection. My guess is that he addressed it because people were speculating about it for 2 years - but the story could have worked just as well just completely ignoring it. I don't even really know why Rey is concerned with who her parents are. If I were her I wouldn't be thinking about that, but I guess she thinks it will give her some kind of guidance...

If she did find out she was a Kenobi, that information would mean next to nothing to her, unless she's heard of Obi-wan Kenobi like she's heard of Luke Skywalker.

It does seem hard to figure how a parentage reveal would mean anything to the overall story at this point. And it would seem contradictory to what Rian presented. However, I think he contradicted the Rey mystery box himself, so... maybe J.J. will contradict again.

If Korkie Kryze was Obi-wan's son, and Rey his daughter, I think that Rey being a missing, possibly kidnapped Mandalorian princess is a stronger narrative hook than the fact that she would be related to Obi-wan. I think that could make a good movie, being that the Mandalorians are a warrior culture torn apart by these galactic wars, and tending to be fiercely independent of the larger galactic conflict and suspicious of the Jedi. This might be a good backdrop for a tale about bringing the Skywalker saga to a satisfying close. If that were the case, having Rey be connected in that way could serve a narrative purpose. An Obi-wan lineage wouldn't really matter much in that scenario, but would add poetry in retrospect.

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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by ReyofLightSide on Sun 31 Dec 2017, 6:25 pm

I still wonder, why did JJ have Daisy adjust her accent for the role?
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by TheBastardofMandalore on Sun 31 Dec 2017, 7:45 pm

@fuhry wrote:@BigDeal2187

I always liked the Rey Kenobi idea, and I thought it could be possible that Obi-wan fathered a child while on Tatooine.  But I never believed in it until I saw the Clone Wars Duchess Satine story arc - because it seemed that we were being set up for descendants of Kenobi to possibly pop up in future stories.

That said, the Satine/Korkie thing was created by George Lucas who may or may not have been in negotiations with Disney at that point.  George obviously likes these types of familial connections, and this could easily be something that was thrown out along with a lot of other George ideas.

Given the TLJ story, occurring mere days after the events of TFA, there's really no space or narrative necessity for a parentage reveal.  Whether it was set up as an intentional mystery box in TFA (I think so) or it just happened that way because fans expected that kind of connection, I think it's completely understandable that Rian didn't make a big deal out of it.  Except, he kind of did make a big deal out of it by emphasizing her lack of familial connection.  My guess is that he addressed it because people were speculating about it for 2 years - but the story could have worked just as well just completely ignoring it.  I don't even really know why Rey is concerned with who her parents are.  If I were her I wouldn't be thinking about that, but I guess she thinks it will give her some kind of guidance...

If she did find out she was a Kenobi, that information would mean next to nothing to her, unless she's heard of Obi-wan Kenobi like she's heard of Luke Skywalker.  

It does seem hard to figure how a parentage reveal would mean anything to the overall story at this point.  And it would seem contradictory to what Rian presented.  However, I think he contradicted the Rey mystery box himself, so... maybe J.J. will contradict again.

If Korkie Kryze was Obi-wan's son, and Rey his daughter, I think that Rey being a missing, possibly kidnapped Mandalorian princess is a stronger narrative hook than the fact that she would be related to Obi-wan.  I think that could make a good movie, being that the Mandalorians are a warrior culture torn apart by these galactic wars, and tending to be fiercely independent of the larger galactic conflict and suspicious of the Jedi.  This might be a good backdrop for a tale about bringing the Skywalker saga to a satisfying close.   If that were the case, having Rey be connected in that way could serve a narrative purpose.  An Obi-wan lineage wouldn't really matter much in that scenario, but would add poetry in retrospect.  

@fuhry

This!!!! ^^^^^
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Re: The Rey Kenobi Files

Post by spacebaby45678 on Mon 01 Jan 2018, 2:47 am

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