Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker

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Post by motherofpearl1 on 5/12/2019, 9:43 am

Only problem with Q'ira being Rey's mum is some troll would insist that it meant Han was her dad. Despite the fact that they split years before Ben Solo, who's ten years older, was even conceived.
Actually, Kira being Rey's mum would be an interesting twist, but I doubt they'll go there.


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Post by SanghaRen on 5/12/2019, 9:49 am

@DarthRen wrote:1. We will learn more about Vader and Palpatine.
YES, about Palpatine.

2. Kylo will have a scene with Leia.
NO, sadly I do not believe that.

3. Rey will find out more about her parents.
YES, there is more to them and I suppose Palpatine might be tied into this. Nothing like Rey Skywalker or Rey Solo.

4. Rey will be tempted by the darkside.
NO, she already had a chance.

5. Kylo will train Rey.
NO, that ship has sailed in TLJ. Rey will be a legit force user by the time they meet again.

6. Kylo and Rey will duel.
YES, before things get better. Somewhere like end of Act I or so.

7. Kylo and Rey will be stuck or stranded somewhere having to work together to survive.
NO, they'll have to work together as an uneasy allies but not stuck somewhere literally.

8. Either Kylo or Rey will lose a hand or appendage.
NO, but someone else might.

9. Luke will come back as a Force Ghost.
YES, to Rey but not Kylo.

10. Han will be in a flash back.
YES, to Kylo/Ben.

11. We will see the scene of the Knights of Ren from Rey's TFA force vision.
NO, a different one.

12. Anakin will appear as a Force Ghost.
NO, even if i'd love it.

13. Rey will be related to Palpatine.
NO, not directly but he might know something about her origins.

14. Kylo and Rey will team up to fight Palpatine.
YES, during Act III.

15. Kylo and Rey will kiss.
YES, before or after his death is what I'm unsure of. It can work either way but I'd prefer after his rebirth as Ben Solo.

16. Kylo will die (but then rise again).
YES, I think we have a lot of clues to something like this actually happening.

17. Kylo will have a trial for his crimes.
NO, more likely exile either imposed by himself or others.

18. Kylo will be asked to be called Ben Solo.
NO, I think Rey will simply call him Ben.

19. Kylo and Rey end the movie together as an undeniable couple.
YES, I do believe so.

20. This is the last movie we will see Kylo and Rey.
NO, as no one is ever really gone and especially not in SW world.
@DarthRen

I am with you for all except 15, 19 and 20. Still not sure about a full romantic Reylo with kiss and all, but then I am also not that much into it and would find an open end satisfying. Also I don’t believe AD will want to continue playing Kylo and am pretty sure he only went for a contract tying him up to 3 movies. Not sure DR wants to play Rey again neither. However, I could really see a cartoon happening.
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Post by AhsokaTano on 5/12/2019, 10:17 am

Oooh ! Just had another marvel /Star Wars wacky crossover revelation as to who Rey may be and if so we could be getting scorching romance . Bear with me on this one lol! Black widow /Natasha Romanoff. She has the soul stone(brown /yellow ) which means she can manipulate dead souls , it is the gateway to an idyllic pocket dimension in universe ( paradise?star Wars universe that will be created by her as queen?)and she has control over all life in the universe . She gave up her life for it .

Why is she interesting? Because like Rey she came from nothing . She’s not a god . She’s enhanced like captain America so an equal to say Loki but she’s not a god and she loves monsters ( she also sees herself as one at times and talks about not having a place in the world ). . She wants a family like Rey and wants to settle down but she’s been sterilised in the red room when she was enhanced . She is close to Barton ( Hawkeye)with his 3 kids but they are not her 3 kids . ( This is interesting because Loki and Sigyn in the underworld have 3 kids ). At one point she says to Bruce Banner “ I adore you but I need the other guy”. Which other guy ? Most people take that to mean the hulk but what if it’s another monster ? Kylo/Loki in another world of their own making . The Norse belief and marvel belief of under world is that it’s in a pocket dimension within the universe . Probably part of the multiverse. This is probably the Star Wars universe .

It’s interesting how the red throne room in TLJ seemed to suggest the opposite of the red sterile room in avengers - lots of passion and fertility in TLJ.

Natasha had a romance with Bruce Banner and have you seen how she interacts with Loki in avengers ? She even calls him a monster like Rey . Their dynamic is very interesting , very push and pull and they have a lot of shippers . If they get together . Sparks will fly . Literally . She is the one I think that will change things . Kylo recognises an energy in Rey . We are told he has ancient eyes . She could be the game changer and I reckon she could be our Sigyn too .Loki’s wife . It’s no coincidence she was shown with blonde hair in infinity war I think because Sigyn has blonde hair when not in underworld( though I know we normally see her with red or brownish hair ). Natasha /Natalia which is her name means birth of Christ( the chosen one ) . She fits in with what I said this morning as the clone but she’ll also be the one who heals Kylo/Loki -helps them out of the curse. His soulmate . And I think there’s no going back from the soul stone and she’ll want to stay there . Maybe at this point is when they’ll part for a while because in hades and Persephone myth they live together part of the year ( why we have seasons ) and part of the year they don’t .
Moreover she doesn’t seem to know who her parents are in marvel universe but Loki does say something similar to throne room kylo and Rey and that she could possibly be descended from the czars of Russia . Anastasia links anyone ??? Remember how we were told this was the story of a prince and princess and that it was connected to Anastasia? It’s crazy I know.
It would take on new meaning to kylo’s meaning in interrogation room ( reverse interrogation of when Natasha interrogated Loki in avengers and there was that quote between. “How do we do this ? As a team “. ) and Kylo senses an energy between him and Rey and says “ don’t be afraid I feel it too” and his arrogant prince quote “ I can take whatever I want”. Lol!

Below is a lovely essay about Sigyn and her relationship with Loki which kind of sums up the above and what they could be going for . Their relationship is special . Dark and light working as a team. Opposites but one can’t live without the other. Sigyn has a lot of the attributes that Natasha and Rey both have .
https://www.google.com/amp/s/lokiheals.wordpress.com/2017/07/16/sigyn-goddess-of-divine-victory/amp/


Again take with a pinch of salt .
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Post by DarthRen on 5/12/2019, 12:31 pm

@SanghaRen wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:1. We will learn more about Vader and Palpatine.
YES, about Palpatine.

2. Kylo will have a scene with Leia.
NO, sadly I do not believe that.

3. Rey will find out more about her parents.
YES, there is more to them and I suppose Palpatine might be tied into this. Nothing like Rey Skywalker or Rey Solo.

4. Rey will be tempted by the darkside.
NO, she already had a chance.

5. Kylo will train Rey.
NO, that ship has sailed in TLJ. Rey will be a legit force user by the time they meet again.

6. Kylo and Rey will duel.
YES, before things get better. Somewhere like end of Act I or so.

7. Kylo and Rey will be stuck or stranded somewhere having to work together to survive.
NO, they'll have to work together as an uneasy allies but not stuck somewhere literally.

8. Either Kylo or Rey will lose a hand or appendage.
NO, but someone else might.

9. Luke will come back as a Force Ghost.
YES, to Rey but not Kylo.

10. Han will be in a flash back.
YES, to Kylo/Ben.

11. We will see the scene of the Knights of Ren from Rey's TFA force vision.
NO, a different one.

12. Anakin will appear as a Force Ghost.
NO, even if i'd love it.

13. Rey will be related to Palpatine.
NO, not directly but he might know something about her origins.

14. Kylo and Rey will team up to fight Palpatine.
YES, during Act III.

15. Kylo and Rey will kiss.
YES, before or after his death is what I'm unsure of. It can work either way but I'd prefer after his rebirth as Ben Solo.

16. Kylo will die (but then rise again).
YES, I think we have a lot of clues to something like this actually happening.

17. Kylo will have a trial for his crimes.
NO, more likely exile either imposed by himself or others.

18. Kylo will be asked to be called Ben Solo.
NO, I think Rey will simply call him Ben.

19. Kylo and Rey end the movie together as an undeniable couple.
YES, I do believe so.

20. This is the last movie we will see Kylo and Rey.
NO, as no one is ever really gone and especially not in SW world.
@DarthRen

I am with you for all except 15, 19 and 20. Still not sure about a full romantic Reylo with kiss and all, but then I am also not that much into it and would find an open end satisfying. Also I don’t believe AD will want to continue playing Kylo and am pretty sure he only went for a contract tying him up to 3 movies. Not sure DR wants to play Rey again neither. However, I could really see a cartoon happening.
@SanghaRen

I like to think positively about their kiss and being a couple. The kiss between major couples in previous SW trilogies has happened Han/Leia, Anakin/Padme. They should follow up on it but only when it's Ben Solo IMO. Once he goes through redemption and he's alive, not dead I can see them being an undeniable couple. Their future is entirely up to interpretation. Do they start an academy? Do they have kids and are married?

I can see AD and DR returning like 15 - 20 years from now but not before. Pretty much like Harrison Ford, Mark Hamill and Carrie Fisher returned to SW after so many years. When the story, time is right for that.
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Post by Kessel on 5/12/2019, 3:28 pm

These are my answers to the questions proposed by @Xylo Ren .

1. We will learn more about Vader and Palpatine. -

I hope so! I’m going to say yes if Palpatine is featured. I think we’ll learn more about the projects/experiments he was up to on Jakku. Maybe it’ll tie into Rey in some way. As for Vader, I think we’ll see something about him in Kylo’s story. It would be interesting to learn more about the Skywalkers and why Anakin is the chosen one.i know it’s a popular theory that Palps somehow “created” Anakin, but I think that’s been debunked by the creators?

2. Kylo will have a scene with Leia. -

There has to be something that addresses their relationship in TROS. I don’t know how they’re going to do it, but it would be great to see a poignant scene between them.

3. Rey will find out more about her parents. -

Yes, I hope so. I’m not certain, but didn’t JJ imply there would be more to it? Perhaps it’ll tie into why she was on Jakku.

4. Rey will be tempted by the darkside. -

Perhaps, but I think it’s unlikely in a traditional sense and the third episode seems too late for it.

5. Kylo will train Rey. -

I’m not sure. I don’t think we have enough information to determine if that’s something that will happen.

6. Kylo and Rey will duel. -

Yes for sure.

7. Kylo and Rey will be stuck or stranded somewhere having to work together to survive. -

No, I don’t think it’s likely, but I’ve always liked that scenario.

8. Either Kylo or Rey will lose a hand or appendage. -

No, I don’t think so. That was something symbolic between Anakin and Luke. Also, it’s the last episode so it’s less likely.

9. Luke will come back as a Force Ghost. -

Yes, I think that’s very likely.

10. Han will be in a flash back. -

This would be nice. I hope so.

11. We will see the scene of the Knights of Ren from Rey's TFA force vision. -

Maybe. I think it would make sense to have some follow up on what that scene was about, but I’m not 100% confident we will.

12. Anakin will appear as a Force Ghost. -

It’s possible, but it depends on how the story goes. I don’t know if they’ll do more than one Force ghost.

13. Rey will be related to Palpatine. -

I’d like that and I think it’s maybe possible.

14. Kylo and Rey will team up to fight Palpatine. -

It looks like this is possible. I certainly hope so.

15. Kylo and Rey will kiss. -

I’m not sure. I’d love this to happen, but I’m waiting to see.

16. Kylo will die (but then rise again). -

Yes, this seems quite likely.

17. Kylo will have a trial for his crimes. -

No, I don’t think we’re going to see something so mundane in the final episode of the Skywalker saga.

18. Kylo will be asked to be called Ben Solo. -

I think so. It seems like a logical thing in a redemption.

19. Kylo and Rey end the movie together as an undeniable couple. -

I hope so and I think they will, in some way.

20. This is the last movie we will see Kylo and Rey. -

An actual live action movie? I’d say no. Hopefully there will be future stories in other forms.

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Post by AhsokaTano on 5/12/2019, 5:34 pm

@Xylo Ren
1. We will learn more about Vader and Palpatine. -
Definitely especially as I believe they are sticking to
original plan and he’s the supreme intellect orchestrating everything according to 1983 interview in prevue( found on Reddit ).

2. Kylo will have a scene with Leia. -
Not sure about this one due to limited footage they have to work with . I think her death will
Shake him badly.

3. Rey will find out more about her parents.
Yep but at the end of the day I don’t think it will matter because Rey is her own person .

4. Rey will be tempted by the darkside. -
Yes I think so and I expect her to sport a black outfit too at some point . As kylo gets lighter I think she will show some dark side in her especially if she has dark side origins .

5. Kylo will train Rey. -
Don’t think this is necessary unless by training it means fight training with kylo. She has already downloaded what she needed via him the novel tells us . He sifted through her memories and she downloaded his skills and training .

6. Kylo and Rey will duel. -
Yeah but only to show what’s really happening force wise with the flash fights and what their mission is . And it will be a scorching and sexy fight just like the push and pull of their dynamic .

7. Kylo and Rey will be stuck or stranded somewhere having to work together to survive. -
I really hope so otherwise how else is their relationship supposed to grow .unless it’s all via force bond . Give me stranded scenes ... lol!

8. Either Kylo or Rey will lose a hand or appendage. -
No I think we are past this because of reasons i cited above - am not ruling out whether they would be connected to AI , just not visible machine more like a clone .

9. Luke will come back as a Force Ghost. -
Yeah because no one is ever really gone and they come back ( I have theory it’s the underworld see above and why people keep coming back )

10. Han will be in a flash back. -
Yeah I hope so -this would be nice

11. We will see the scene of the Knights of Ren from Rey's TFA force vision. -
Yes though at this point am not sure if it’s part of the flash fight and whether it’s in past or future

12. Anakin will appear as a Force Ghost. -
Yep because no one is ever really gone and am sure for the final film we are going to see as many of the saga cast as possible

13. Rey will be related to Palpatine. -
I want her to be Kenobi but I think she comes from the dark and is possibly Palpatine but am not sure who Palpatine is at this stage and have my theories

14. Kylo and Rey will team up to fight Palpatine. -
Yeah but there will be a twist to it as not all will look like what it seems

15. Kylo and Rey will kiss. -
By all that is right, good and proper I hope we get a lot more than this and that those leaks I put in crack few months back about them taking it further are true . Potentially they could make this the most epic romance ever to have graced the big screen.Soulmates that transcend time, space , dimensions.

16. Kylo will die (but then rise again). -Yes but potentially he will be changed not just mentally but physically because he can change his form after he’s transcended death ( that’s what I think it means to be skywalker)

17. Kylo will have a trial for his crimes. -
No I don’t think so - I think there could be exile for a while because his journey takes him on a different path but that he will always come back because this will be his home and his kingdom

18. Kylo will be asked to be called Ben Solo. -
I don’t know to be honest because an connecting him him to someone else and Kylo is an anagram of that name . I think he may take on a new name or have Ben or Kylo when he’s home with Rey in his world and a different name outside it

19. Kylo and Rey end the movie together as an undeniable couple. -
I think so and especially if they are who I think they are - it will be epic but bittersweet

20. This is the last movie we will see Kylo and Rey. -
Nope I don’t think so . We’ll see them again Very Happy




















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Post by snufkin on 5/12/2019, 7:24 pm

If KK's comment about TROS being a 'culmination' for the plot being about making things right and the truth that is your family, then these different moments from 4 separate films are going to come together around a quote from Lawrence Kasdan's 2015 interview for Vanity Fair's cover story (not hard to notice it was written by a better writer than David Kamp or Joanna Robinson whose stellar contributions are RomanceGate and "Rey's relationship with Kylo is a cautionary tale for young ladies.") Which not so coincidentally is the meta meaning of Luke's "A thousand generations live inside of you. We've passed on everything we know but now it's your fight" voiceover in the teaser:

I think everything that I’ve ever directed and written is about that in one way or another. And I’ll tell you something, I’ve got three grandchildren now and that theme just comes up every day. How am I affecting them? Is my experience of any use to them? Do they give a s**t? I’ve just been reading a lot of Dennis Lehane. He’s obsessed with the same things that I am: fathers and sons and passing on wisdom; the inability to gain wisdom, which is really what interests me; and death, which defines all our life.

It is what it is, Star Wars needs to get its sh*t together with mothers* and maybe would've if Carrie had survived. But boy do the writers love to talk about fathers and sons. Hell even Carrie said her wit and writing came out of being abandoned by her father as the defense mechanism of a 5 year old hoping if she were clever and entertaining enough, he'd want to return to the family.

Cut for being gif intensive, but they might as well have had Maz's House Band performing Cat's in the Cradle:

Poor Mitaka has to report to Kylo Ren about the droid escaping capture on a YT Model Corellian Freighter
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 Tumblr_o5wmq9Qe5h1qkn1eho3_500


Where has Kylo Ren heard of this type of ship before and maybe it has to do something more than just the droid escaping capture?
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 Screen13
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Lando to Han, "You close with your old man?"
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 Screen16

** Speaking of Unca Wanwo, not a coincidence that he tells Han in the first scene with the Falcon that he built a custom escape pod. Which we then 40+ years later see Rey use, with "Property of Han Solo" on it no less. Ben's godfather and father enable her rescue mission to the Supremacy

The Face of My Son
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 Screen17
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 Dsdcrw10

It's Like Poetry
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 Screen18
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 Screen20
Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 1cedeb5b957ff078dc06a3538364c615


Predictions for The Rise of Skywalker - Page 7 LINQn9h

* Seriously this is one of the most likely themes/plot points for the ST and Saga but it's still kinda effed up to put it all out in writing on Mother's Day. It's not a coincidence that the character who most has their s**t together is Lando, who's also apparently the only major character whose mother was able to raise her child


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Post by californiagirl on 5/12/2019, 10:59 pm

So... on a kind-of unrelated note, I've read the GoT/ASOIAF books but have only seen bits of the show, yet the meltdowns over GoT the past few seasons, and especially the past few weeks, have been unlike almost anything I've seen. The storytelling, and the way women and POC are treated, are making people scared for the D&D SW series. Would it be in LF's interests to remove them, or will they look bad for doing so after the similar Trevorrow, Gareth, L&M, and Trank debacles?

In a weird twisted way, maybe this makes me slightly more hopeful for the reception to TROS, which I've been dreading since 2015. If people say "this makes no sense, this wasn't set up, this character development was bad, this is inconsistent and incoherent, this was reactionary, they're so amateurish they don't have a plan, this story is bad to women," could other people just point to GoT in response? Like if the bar is this low, it shouldn't be hard for the ST to clear it.

Depending on how D&D, who don't like themes and kind of write based on fulfilling or upsetting fan theories, respond to the show's end and talk about their creative process, this could make JJ and Rian, KK and the SG look really good come December/January. Hey, I'm trying to make the best of a bad situation.
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Post by MaddieDove on 5/13/2019, 6:51 am

They are a disappointment, that's for sure. Were they ever considered for SW as authors/creatives, or just producers? They did good job in previous seasons as producers. I do hope if they remain on board, it is in that capacity only. Who knows anyways who is responsible for making key decisions.

There were also rumors about their and Rian's trilogy being one and the same, meaning that Rian would create story, and direct at least the first movie, and D&D be executive producers. I got the sense that Rian works well with Ram Bergman, but what would I know about what producing a series of movies entails.

In any case, this shows how rare are talents needed for something like Star Wars, in a generation of creatives born in the 1970s. Technical skills are there, and popcorn fare like Marvel can be produced as in the assembly line, but not many people are capable of creating magic. Disney live action movies are mostly soulless (e.g. Alice in Wonderland, Into the Woods, Nutcracker), very hyped Ava DuVernay was such a disappointment with AWIT. LF needs, in light of all of that, to be even more protective of their key talents (RJ and JJ), and praise them even more than they're doing now (especially RJ).
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Post by motherofpearl1 on 5/13/2019, 8:02 am

TBH I am frankly sick of TLJ hate. I agree it wasn't perfect......the Canto Bight sequence although spectacular, didn't add much to the film (apart from a nice knock at animal cruelty), and I still feel a bit angry at Rey's behaviour post the throne room battle....
But the pros vastly outweighed the cons. They delved deeper into the personalities of the characters than in any SW movie. No one was perfect.....not even Holdo. Good guys made bad mistakes, bad guys showed their humanity, and it made a bigger impact on me than all of the prequels.
I just hope the stupid reaction of petulant so called fans towards it won't sway JJ into changing story direction come TRoS.
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Post by giaciak2 on 5/13/2019, 9:18 am

@AhsokaTano wrote:@Xylo Ren


19. Kylo and Rey end the movie together as an undeniable couple. -
I think so and especially if they are who I think they are - it will be epic but bittersweet

What is your idea?




















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Post by SW_Heroine_Journey on 5/13/2019, 10:03 am

@californiagirl wrote:So... on a kind-of unrelated note, I've read the GoT/ASOIAF books but have only seen bits of the show, yet the meltdowns over GoT the past few seasons, and especially the past few weeks, have been unlike almost anything I've seen. The storytelling, and the way women and POC are treated, are making people scared for the D&D SW series. Would it be in LF's interests to remove them, or will they look bad for doing so after the similar Trevorrow, Gareth, L&M, and Trank debacles?

In a weird twisted way, maybe this makes me slightly more hopeful for the reception to TROS, which I've been dreading since 2015. If people say "this makes no sense, this wasn't set up, this character development was bad, this is inconsistent and incoherent, this was reactionary, they're so amateurish they don't have a plan, this story is bad to women," could other people just point to GoT in response? Like if the bar is this low, it shouldn't be hard for the ST to clear it.

Depending on how D&D, who don't like themes and kind of write based on fulfilling or upsetting fan theories, respond to the show's end and talk about their creative process, this could make JJ and Rian, KK and the SG look really good come December/January. Hey, I'm trying to make the best of a bad situation.
@californiagirl

This is a phenomenal silver lining! Especially because those who seem to like this season of GoT will probably not like TROS, so it will be easier to dismiss them/shrug them off. Smile Very Happy

As for D&D, if KK is sensitive about the critique that she fires too many people, I think they will be greatly demoted. Receive a producer credit, yet those in the show business world know it is in name only, and Rian (plus others yet to be named, hopefully women and POC) will have more storytelling, directing, and producing power.

If KK isn't sensitive about that critique, hopefully they will be fired soon, and if they see the handwriting on the wall, they resign first.
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Post by californiagirl on 5/13/2019, 1:06 pm

@motherofpearl1 He's claimed it hasn't affected the story, although the popular belief has said otherwise. Pablo and some of the other SG people really don't care what fans think, to a fault even.

@MaddieDove This was the original announcement. It says they would write and produce. They did both with GoT from very early on, writing 50+ episodes. https://www.starwars.com/news/game-of-thrones-creators-david-benioff-and-d-b-weiss-to-write-and-produce-a-new-series-of-star-wars-films

But with the more recent announcement that they were working closely with Rian, it does make me think it might be one trilogy, especially since they both said they were to begin work shortly after their other projects wrap this year. Or two closely-related trilogies, like if Rian does the origin of the Jed or something more child-friendly as he had indicated, and D&D do the Old Republic or something. And only three SW movie dates have been announced, which would indicate a trilogy unless they take go back and forth between two series, but that would make 4 years between films, and I don't see them doing that.
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Post by AhsokaTano on 5/13/2019, 1:40 pm

@giaciak2
If you scroll up above and read my posts from yesterday( there were two before I answered the questions - one about Natasha from avengers being possibly Sigyn /Rey and the other about generally how I thought Star Wars was going to go now that multiverse is canon etc. They were a bit rambly and long so I apologise and am sure it’s my imagination playing havoc with me and it’s all coincidences because they are run by the same corporation but the idea that Kylo and Rey is a literal or re-telling of hades and Persephone, Loki and Sigyn( Natasha from avengers which means day of the chosen one ) and Star Wars takes place in the underworld is an idea that won’t go away for me for now.
Moreover it ties in with Anastasia and the lost princess claims which Jett Lucas ( George Lucas’s Son) said this trilogy saga is all about and it’s epic . Epic to the point that they really are soulmates that transcend time , space and dimensions . When you hear Kylo say to rey in the interrogation don’t be afraid I feel it too and that they sense an energy they recognise in each other it’s literally epic.

I also think it’s been planned from the start . As pointed out here too Kylo is an anagram of Loky ( a variant spelling of the name ). And skywalker is a name Loki uses.

Reason why I say it’s planned from the start is look at loki’s Interrogation by Natasha in Avengers Assemble - it’s like a mirror image of kylo’s interrogation of Rey in the mirror underworld ( if this is what Star Wars is)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HN3iOH7L4Cc

Even down to the fact that he knows where she comes from and tells her ( czars ) and mentions similar words like liars , thief’s and also how she calls him a monster and gets one over on him . Leaving him
Baffled just like Kylo is shocked by Rey . It’s hard to trick Loki and be one step ahead of him . He’s met his match literally.He’s quite vicious in this scene because he hasn’t been redeemed yet and will change in the underworld( yes he’ll always be a bandit and angel at same time but the underworld will change him). Even the accents in the Natasha /Loki scene and Kylo/Rey interrogation scenes are reversed - it’s incredible . Kylo has American English accent , Rey English Uk And Natasha and Loki the opposite . Moreover Natasha is Loki’s equal . She’s not a god though and human ( and like captain America has been experimented on , enhanced , sterilised ) but she’s mistress of illusion like Loki and totally his equal and clearly outwits him too and I believe she will be his goddess in the underworld. And it’s a mirror world so she will have children . Loki is also the god of fatherhood and a Sigyn fertility. Throughout the marvel films Natasha and Loki’s story arc has been mainly hidden ( people have said why so little content concerning them ?). She say to the hulk -at one point I don’t need this monster but the Other monster i think she’s referring to Loki. She also says this life is an illusion - I wish I was an avenger but am not which is weird and like Rey
she’s also desperate for family and children of her own which she can’t have in our earth dimension but will do with Loki/kylo in the underworld. She was shown with blonde hair in Infinity war ( Sigyn is meant to have blonde hair outside of the underworld) and she now has the soul stone and sacrificed herself to go into the underworld.
The soul stone will take you to a pocket dimension in the universe and give you powers to free the dead . The multiverse is also canon in marvel now .

https://www.google.com/amp/s/lokiheals.wordpress.com/2017/07/16/sigyn-goddess-of-divine-victory/amp/
I said it’s bittersweet because if you look at the myth of hades and Persephone etc they spend half the year together in their underworld paradise ( which am even wondering if it could become the new Asgard
as the asgardian gorgeous home planet like beautiful Alderaan was destroyed)and the rest apart ( explaining why we get winter and summer ).
Yes Loki can be perceived as a villain but he’s more anti hero to me . One minute am rooting for him and the next he’s behaving like a scroundrel lol.

Anyway read the above because hearing that in 1983 they were planning a 9 part saga with supreme intellect ( which is in captain marvel ) is what kind of made me think too this is what they are doing as this comes up in the Star Wars comics too ( dr Aphra ).

It could all be coincidence so take with Grain of salt . Will be interesting to see what Spider-Man reveals in the summer about the multiverse and whether further hints that Star Wars is part of it.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on 5/13/2019, 1:44 pm

I'm a Loki fan myself, both Marvel's version and the real one.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on 5/13/2019, 3:15 pm

I'm a Loki fan myself, both Marvel's version and the real one.
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Post by Chris24601 on 5/13/2019, 3:35 pm

@californiagirl wrote:So... on a kind-of unrelated note, I've read the GoT/ASOIAF books but have only seen bits of the show, yet the meltdowns over GoT the past few seasons, and especially the past few weeks, have been unlike almost anything I've seen. The storytelling, and the way women and POC are treated, are making people scared for the D&D SW series. Would it be in LF's interests to remove them, or will they look bad for doing so after the similar Trevorrow, Gareth, L&M, and Trank debacles?
@californiagirl
The people blowing up at Game of Thrones are the exactly same people who blew up at The Last Jedi for going where the story had been set to get instead of their head canon (literally... Thor Skywalker just did a video on how they completely trashed what was never more than headcanon).

The author of Game of Thrones was staunchly anti-war to the point of registering and serving as a conscientious objector (instead of running away/dodging the draft like many did). There's no way a conqueror like Dany was ever going to be anything but the villain.

Dany's arc was basically identical to Anakin Skywalker (only with even more signs on the way that she was going to ultimately become a villain). Powerless kid goes from nobody to "hero" to nightmare ("hero" because her misanthropy was disguised in earlier seasons by being focused on a** victims, but it was always there).

The last episode was her "Murder the Younglings" moment and I've seen it coming for YEARS. I first really noticed it in season five, but going back you could see the signs as far back as the first season if you stopped to really look at it. Her first real act of power was to murder a slave woman for the crime of killing the master who'd ordered her villain slaughtered and had been raped repeated by his men... it was just easy to overlook at the time because in the story, particularly when told from Dany's PoV as it was in the books, the person she killed was her husband Khal Drogo.

So just like so many missed the Reylo and Bendemption arcs in TFA and TLJ; these same people completely missed that the great white savior who was invading a country she'd never set foot in in her life with a Manifest Destiny claim to the Throne, an army of masked fanatically devoted black armored warriors, a horde that embodied every horror story ever told about the Mongol Hordes, burned her enemies alive from the back of a great black dragon and who's previous lair was, I kid you not, a freaking Ziggurat was NOT the hero of the story.

They'd completely bought into Dany's own hype that she was coming to bring freedom and justice (if you bend the knee... if not you die screaming in the flames) and magic unicorns and are now butthurt that the story where she gets a magic baby and rules wisely and justly in a show of progressive girl power was all just a fevered fanfic dream when true equal representation is that girls are allowed to be villains just like boys are.

So no... I don't think D&D are a problem. The problem, as always, is butthurt fanboys who aren't getting their way.

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Post by californiagirl on 5/13/2019, 5:18 pm

@Chris24601 It seems the so-called fanboys are actually the ones who liked the episode/recent seasons, and Harloff is going around dismissing all the criticism, claiming it's just because the show is popular. Like dude, you're a critic, you're in the BFCA and go to premieres, you should be better than this. It's the opposite, more observant group who hated it. Every well-spoken, educated Reylo on my feed is livid, sad, and scared. If anything, this seems like the inverse of the TLJ debacle.

I've read the books, though the show later took its own direction, and I had no theories whatsoever about where this would all end. I'm getting the impression Danerys' development was a sudden pivot, and that many characters suddenly regressed without reason or buildup. Like if they wanted to eventually go the Mad Queen route, a sort of inevitability that she really is like her Targaryen lineage, killing a bunch of innocent civilians without hesitation seems a bit of a sharp turn. Like they skipped episodes or seasons of buildup where she begins to act on those darker urges to murder bystanders for sport. Comparisons to Anakin aren't really flattering, the PT didn't handle that development as well as it could have either, nor was it well-paced. I get why Emilia Clarke is upset, but she's being a trooper about it, unlike Mark's deal with Luke.

D&D don't like themes, base their stories and character developments on or against internet fanbase ideas, treat the women and POC characters unevenly and hold them to different standards (the episode explicitly says this is why women shouldn't be given power), and are fairly inarticulate when discussing their writing. George Martin told them some things, but there's a hard and fast ending date to the show, so the pacing just went offbase. The ST isn't ambling around in it's major themes and overall point, but I don't get that impression from GoT. Unlike TLJ, reviews are mixed at best for the past two episodes.

However, Rian says he's friends with D&D, so there very well might be something there we're not seeing.
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Post by snufkin on 5/13/2019, 9:02 pm

Benioff is literally one of my worst experiences ever as a reader. I would've experienced less misery being in the middle of the actual Battle of Stalingrad than having to slog through City of Thieves, his Cormac McCarthy fanfiction about it. That is to say, he tried to write it McCarthy style except without any of the wit or insight McCarthy has into his characters. Or even the underlying humanity of the characters in the novel he was trying emulate,  The Road.  So while I'm not surprised that people are concerned about allowing him and his writing partner access to the Star Wars universe for a number of reasons, speaking just as a reader his writing is Trevorrow levels of terrible.

Forgot another moment I discovered from the Solo rewatch which is an interesting thread to the ST when 1) Lando is returning and is shown reuniting with the Falcon/Chewie dressed in the same outfit he wore during that time period and 2) they're pushing Batuu/Black Spire as the base for the Resistance during the interim period, which turns out Lando had already spent time on.

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Post by Night Huntress on 5/14/2019, 1:45 am

@californiagirl wrote: the episode explicitly says this is why women shouldn't be given power.
@californiagirl

to be fair- men weren't exactly shown to be trusted with power in GoT, either. The "Mad King" (forgot his name) Baratheon, Joffrey, Stannis all of them turned out to be sh*tty leaders. So I don't think the message was "women shouldn't be given power" but "conquering and invading is BAD" and giving too much power to one person is never a good idea. At least that's how I view it. Nope  
Don't say I agree with the execution, but I don't think the message was "women are bad in leader positions" they did better than all the men in this show. Just my opinion.

I mean you could make the argument in SW it's always the male characters that can't be trusted with power (Palpatine, Anakin, Tarkin, Krennik, Snoke, Hux, Kylo) and the "good leaders" are always women (Padmé, Mon Mothma, Leia).
That's why I hoped they would reverse this trope and make Kylo at least an attempted good leader, but that's obviously not going to happen...
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Post by AhsokaTano on 5/14/2019, 2:43 am

@MotherofPearl1
@giaciak2
I too am a big Loki fan and he does change in the comics . You’ve only got to see how he’s changed in the films going from subjugating New York to sacrificing his life for his people and brother . He’s complicated though . I always found him fascinating because he’s so complicated . Thor is the muscle and physical power . Loki the brains and his powers are more ones of the mind like a sorceror . It seems fitting they give him a nine part saga to be honest and dupe the audience because that makes sense if they are trying to show Loki’s story . I think I remember saying at the time on here when I read the Last Jedi comic it was strange in parts - reminded me of the prestige film about magic and how Certain phrases in the comic that Luke used was like a magician pulling off tricks- just phrase’s they say . It’s all falling into place like a puzzle ( something Loki would love)..

The Thing is am not saying these things are going to pass or happen because this is just my speculation and making connections and the writers obviously will write what they want to at the end of the day . But doing a romance like this , so complicated and vast just raises the idea of soulmate to epic levels and what it means to be human , what the soul is and to love someone across the universe( remember Dominic Monaghan’s tweet across the universe?) through everything ,no matter what they look like and who they are because you are soulmates . I mean they could just talk about being soulmates but to show it across two franchises on screen would be epic and truly have the wow factor because then audiences would experience it more . This Kind of reminds me of The fountain film with Hugh Jackman and Rachel Weiss where they live lifetime after lifetime trying to find each other and be with one another . It also makes me think of that Rumi quote they’ve been using on Rise of Skywalker “ out beyond Right there is a field , I’ll meet you there “ and the “ I’ll come back for you sweetheart “ taking on epic proportions because yes they will part ( maybe Will and Elizabeth style in pirates of the Caribbean ) but they have their bond which will tie them together and they’ll always return to each other .

Another thing that just occurred to me is if they are tying the franchises together the infinity stones could all end up in Star Wars universe as potential Jedi relics in lightsabers maybe ? For safe keeping . A place maybe where others can’t get to them ? And if kylo( Loki) ends up with legacy lightsaber as skywalker and gets to keep the space stone then he’s always got a way back home to Star Wars dimension ( possible underworld ).
I remember there was a crack leak a few months back on here that said something about how everyone thinks episode 9 is the end but there would be an episode 10 but kylo’s journey would take him on a different path and Rey , finn and Poe would be on another . They’ve announced episodes 10,11&12 and everyone is assuming it’s knights of the old republic but what if it isn’t ?
Who knows what they have planned ? No one does as it’s all speculation and assumption ( a bit like my theories lol!).

Anyway take what I say with a pinch/grain of salt as always Smile
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Post by motherofpearl1 on 5/14/2019, 3:06 am

At the end of the day, I think by stating that TRoS is 'the end of the Skywalker saga' is a clever bit of misdirection, and it's really referring to Leia rather than Kylo. She is the last to bear the Skywalker name. Carrie's tragic passing:( means her role will be reduced sadly, but I suspect Leia was never meant to survive IX. Kylo is a Skywalker by blood, but a Solo in name, and it's interesting that Snoke essentially makes such a point of his heritage in TLJ. Interesting because although in the OT Han was initially introduced as a self serving mercenary, Ben inherited his compassion from his father - which I suspect exactly why Snoke chose him as the 'sacrificial lamb' whose slaughter would cement Kylo's transition to complete darkness......and how it backfired.
Regarding GoT, Danny's fall from grace was something I started to suspect after her execution of Sam's brother and father. And I never wanted her to end up with Jon in any case as they are aunt and nephew and interbreeding is what ultimately destroyed the Targaeryan bloodline.
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Post by californiagirl on 5/14/2019, 11:18 am

@Night Huntress It just seems that female characters get punished for things the male characters don't, or are framed differently than men in the show who also do atrocious, insane things. The execution was so rapid partly because of limited time, but it's kind of in D&D's wheelhouse to do things for maximum shock value. Things can he horribly shocking without sacrificing adequate development.

Anyway, here's to hoping KK and Co. have a firm hand over whatever they do for their movie coming out in a few years. I don't want Star Wars to be bad.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on 5/14/2019, 11:31 am

Very embarrassed to ask this but.....
Who are D & D?
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Post by californiagirl on 5/14/2019, 11:44 am

@motherofpearl1 David Benioff and D. B. (Daniel Brett) Weiss, creators/producers/writers of GoT. I've also abbreviated it B & W, but D&D is generally how it's done.
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