Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors

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Post by Mila95 on Tue 10 Sep 2019, 5:39 pm

I liked the idea that the new jedi order Rey creates gets called Skywalkers, I remember reading a lot of those theories after the title dropped. I feel like something like that would have been a nice way to keep the name going in some way while also letting go of it in a way and making room for not Skywalker related protagonists. And there's Ben to keep the bloodline going but through a different name that has just as much relevance.


I don't think Rey taking the Skywalker name if the leaks are true is a problem when it comes to Reylo i mostly just think it's a lame way to please everyone and unearned based on a the pretty cold relationship Luke and Rey had that I doubt will be developed all that much now that he's a force ghost.

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Post by 12 Parsnips on Tue 10 Sep 2019, 5:47 pm

@Saracene wrote:I’m pretty sure that Leia herself would rather honour the man who loved and raised her, rather than her biolact,ogical Skywalker father. So Ben honouring his mother by adopting the name his mother never wanted doesn’t really work IMO.
@Saracene

Oh yes, I think Leia thinks of Bail as her real father, and rightly so. But I kind of hope as long as we are redeeming and healing things that Leia comes to terms with Anakin being her biological father. In fact, I think her not telling Ben who his grandfather was was a huge part of Ben's "downfall" (Bloodline). So if Leia reconciled herself to being a Skywalker, I would be sooooo happy because it would mean she came to peace with that herself, and something in her was healed.

I realize we probably won't have time for all that in TRoS, but I gotta dream! I just want to see Leia as a mom dealing with her own issues that have contributed to messing up her child. Han did it in TFA. Luke dealt with his "sins" toward Ben in TLJ. Now I want to see Leia welcome her son home when they are both healing.

It's amazing that this ST is speaking to me as a middle-aged person through our OT heroes who are now also middle-aged! Of course I'm here for Reylo too. Wink
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Post by Saracene on Tue 10 Sep 2019, 6:52 pm

@Mila95 wrote:I liked the idea that the new jedi order Rey creates gets called Skywalkers, I remember reading a lot of those theories after the title dropped. I feel like something like that would have been a nice way to keep the name going in some way while also letting go of it in a way and making room for not Skywalker related protagonists. And there's Ben to keep the bloodline going but through a different name that has just as much relevance.
@Mila95

I remember reading lots of these theories too and this honestly would make a lot more sense, at least.

I can just imagine the conversations Rey would have otherwise:

Random person: "So what's your name?"
Rey: "I'm Rey, Rey Skywalker."
"WOW you're Luke Skywalker's daughter??"
"Well, no."
"Niece?"
"No."
"Umm... adopted daughter?"
"No."
"Then why are you a Skywalker?"
"I just took the name."
"...."
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Post by californiagirl on Tue 10 Sep 2019, 7:30 pm

I still think Jedi is even more marketable than Skywalker, imo, since SW is tied more to them than even the Skywalkers. The backlash against dumping the term Jedi wouldn't be worth the uproar. They're releasing a video game called Jedi Fallen Order, just so a month later they can be like, nah, we don't do Jedi anymore? Combined with Luke claiming he won't be the last Jedi, it seems likely the word will stay. The alternative isn't intuitive, and sort of confusing. That might just leave a bad taste in people's mouths coming out of TROS.
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Post by Mila95 on Tue 10 Sep 2019, 8:08 pm

@californiagirl wrote:I still think Jedi is even more marketable than Skywalker, imo, since SW is tied more to them than even the Skywalkers. The backlash against dumping the term Jedi wouldn't be worth the uproar. They're releasing a video game called Jedi Fallen Order, just so a month later they can be like, nah, we don't do Jedi anymore? Combined with Luke claiming he won't be the last Jedi, it seems likely the word will stay. The alternative isn't intuitive, and sort of confusing. That might just leave a bad taste in people's mouths coming out of TROS.
@californiagirl

True, it might have been a too big of a change for people.

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Post by Gemini on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 3:59 am

Also, not to sure how I feel about Rey Skywalker (non relation) in regards to Ben and his redemption? Rey Skywalker indicates that the Rise of Skywalker is about someone taking the Skywalker name out of respect, not about  Kylo redemption?

Just makes zero sense! Mad

Unless it means both?
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Post by SanghaRen on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 7:56 am

I just read very quickly the Snoke comics on my phone. I just could not wait to be at home tonight to read it. I love it. Probably should go in the novel thread, but I can't access it right now and there are very interesting bits and pieces in it. Nothing spoilery, but it does make you want to know more. And the drawing style is nice. I will put spoilers on my highlights, just for the people who want to read it first.

Spoiler:

- Snoke knows about Dagobah. How??
- When Ben expresses surprise at Snoke seemingly having respect for Luke, he answers that Luke has earned his respect and his fear (how??) and adds "If I had your uncle by my side instead of you, the galaxy would have been mine a long time ago." What a nasty piece of s***.
- Snoke is physically violent with Ben - which we knew even if we hadn't seen it -, he punches him in the face when he dares trying to discuss his order to leave the mask behind.
- Ben does strike down Luke in the cave but not his parents. He lashes out at a tree instead and destroys the cave (Rey can't go there, now). Snoke is happy because he shows anger and determination ("you won't need other apprentices" he tells Snoke after he tells him that he might have like to take other apprentices here), but that probably also showed him that Ben would still rather destroy something else as his parents hence the disguised order to kill Han in TFA.

The profile at the end is also playing with the audience "All of these things are a mystery. Perhaps they will always be." Hear the fans screaming (me included)?
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Post by Cowgirlsamurai on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 9:53 am

@SanghaRen

Thanks so much for the highlights! I will probably never get around to reading the comics.

Spoiler related:
Snoke is so slow moving and speaking (not to mention decrepit-looking) that it’s hard to imagine him landing a punch on anyone, much less Ben Solo Laughing
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Post by Lovely_Rose on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 9:56 am

So based on “leaks” we’re supposed to believe Ben just dies at the end all the while LF is ramping up sympathy for the character with content like this. OK.

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Post by OrionStars on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 10:07 am

@SanghaRen wrote:I just read very quickly the Snoke comics on my phone. I just could not wait to be at home tonight to read it. I love it. Probably should go in the novel thread, but I can't access it right now and there are very interesting bits and pieces in it. Nothing spoilery, but it does make you want to know more. And the drawing style is nice. I will put spoilers on my highlights, just for the people who want to read it first.

Spoiler:

- Snoke knows about Dagobah. How??
- When Ben expresses surprise at Snoke seemingly having respect for Luke, he answers that Luke has earned his respect and his fear (how??) and adds "If I had your uncle by my side instead of you, the galaxy would have been mine a long time ago." What a nasty piece of s***.
- Snoke is physically violent with Ben - which we knew even if we hadn't seen it -, he punches him in the face when he dares trying to discuss his order to leave the mask behind.
- Ben does strike down Luke in the cave but not his parents. He lashes out at a tree instead and destroys the cave (Rey can't go there, now). Snoke is happy because he shows anger and determination ("you won't need other apprentices" he tells Snoke after he tells him that he might have like to take other apprentices here), but that probably also showed him that Ben would still rather destroy something else as his parents hence the disguised order to kill Han in TFA.

The profile at the end is also playing with the audience "All of these things are a mystery. Perhaps they will always be." Hear the fans screaming (me included)?
@SanghaRen



Wow, they really did it, they chose to explore Ben's past in the comic instead of showing it on the big screen for the worldwide audience to see. Now we will have to watch the past of Poe (a supporting character in TFA) and his love interest in TROS, the final movie of Ben's family saga. Yeet.
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 10:35 am

@OrionStars wrote:
@SanghaRen wrote:I just read very quickly the Snoke comics on my phone. I just could not wait to be at home tonight to read it. I love it. Probably should go in the novel thread, but I can't access it right now and there are very interesting bits and pieces in it. Nothing spoilery, but it does make you want to know more. And the drawing style is nice. I will put spoilers on my highlights, just for the people who want to read it first.

Spoiler:

- Snoke knows about Dagobah. How??
- When Ben expresses surprise at Snoke seemingly having respect for Luke, he answers that Luke has earned his respect and his fear (how??) and adds "If I had your uncle by my side instead of you, the galaxy would have been mine a long time ago." What a nasty piece of s***.
- Snoke is physically violent with Ben - which we knew even if we hadn't seen it -, he punches him in the face when he dares trying to discuss his order to leave the mask behind.
- Ben does strike down Luke in the cave but not his parents. He lashes out at a tree instead and destroys the cave (Rey can't go there, now). Snoke is happy because he shows anger and determination ("you won't need other apprentices" he tells Snoke after he tells him that he might have like to take other apprentices here), but that probably also showed him that Ben would still rather destroy something else as his parents hence the disguised order to kill Han in TFA.

The profile at the end is also playing with the audience "All of these things are a mystery. Perhaps they will always be." Hear the fans screaming (me included)?
@SanghaRen



Wow, they really did it, they chose to explore Ben's past in the comic instead of showing it on the big screen for the worldwide audience to see. Now we will have to watch the past of Poe (a supporting character in TFA) and his love interest in TROS, the final movie of Ben's family saga. Yeet.
@OrionStars
There's nothing in this comic that wasn't literally in TLJ or directly inferable from TLJ. I can't even call this exploring Ben's past, it's just a look deeper into his relationship with Snoke. There are multiple scenes in TLJ in which Snoke speaks to Ben exactly like this and way more detail on how Ben's history with Luke shaped his inability to walk away from Snoke. This is how abusers operate. It all ties together, really. As it should.

Poe's past and his relationship with Zorii is probably going to be largely comic relief with a touch of drama surrounding Poe's life before he joined the Resistance. In fact, knowing what we do about the Rey, Kylo and Palpatine side of things I wouldn't be surprised if the Resistance gang (+ the droids) had to support a lot of the levity in the script. That doesn't mean they'll only have comedy and action to play (I'm sure Finn will have more emotional resonance in his relationship with Jannah, another ex storm trooper), but the drama will have to be divided appropriately. John Williams did mention that there would be some comedy between Rey and Kylo so I guess we'll see what that means.
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Post by SanghaRen on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 10:46 am

@OrionStars wrote:
@SanghaRen wrote:I just read very quickly the Snoke comics on my phone. I just could not wait to be at home tonight to read it. I love it. Probably should go in the novel thread, but I can't access it right now and there are very interesting bits and pieces in it. Nothing spoilery, but it does make you want to know more. And the drawing style is nice. I will put spoilers on my highlights, just for the people who want to read it first.

Spoiler:

- Snoke knows about Dagobah. How??
- When Ben expresses surprise at Snoke seemingly having respect for Luke, he answers that Luke has earned his respect and his fear (how??) and adds "If I had your uncle by my side instead of you, the galaxy would have been mine a long time ago." What a nasty piece of s***.
- Snoke is physically violent with Ben - which we knew even if we hadn't seen it -, he punches him in the face when he dares trying to discuss his order to leave the mask behind.
- Ben does strike down Luke in the cave but not his parents. He lashes out at a tree instead and destroys the cave (Rey can't go there, now). Snoke is happy because he shows anger and determination ("you won't need other apprentices" he tells Snoke after he tells him that he might have like to take other apprentices here), but that probably also showed him that Ben would still rather destroy something else as his parents hence the disguised order to kill Han in TFA.

The profile at the end is also playing with the audience "All of these things are a mystery. Perhaps they will always be." Hear the fans screaming (me included)?
@SanghaRen



Wow, they really did it, they chose to explore Ben's past in the comic instead of showing it on the big screen for the worldwide audience to see. Now we will have to watch the past of Poe (a supporting character in TFA) and his love interest in TROS, the final movie of Ben's family saga. Yeet.
@OrionStars

It is the big question: how much will they show of Ben's past and Snoke's past in TRoS. However, I think that what they are showing in this comic is not crucial to the story. It just adds some icing to the cake for the Ben Solo fans. We know Snoke wasn't kind to Ben. Might have helped to see it in the movie but I think the creepy scene in which Snoke hurts Rey and Ben's reaction to it already tells you that. I think it's a genius sequence because the audience automatically transfers what's happening to Rey to what happened to him without seeing it (well done, RJ). What is important to the bigger story is (imo) what happened at the Jedi school and what was Snoke's role in all of it. And I think JJ will include that in TRoS.

Just noticed Fizz beat me to it Smile

ETA: Oh, and I was forgetting the first scene in the throne room where Snoke degrades him and shoots at him with lightning. That's so typical of me, I forget the most obvious scene and jump to the next one.


Last edited by SanghaRen on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 11:02 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Night Huntress on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 11:01 am

I think there is enough "story" left from Ben's past...I personally would love a more deeper view into the timeline before he became Kylo Ren. What happened exactly that Leia sent him to Luke and what happened on the night at the temple after his uncle tried to kill him (or rather thought about it). We already know Snoke was abusive, so that's not really a "new revelation" that has to be in TROS.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 11:05 am

If there's one thing I noticed in both TFA and TLJ is Kylo showed all the signs of being accustomed to pain. Physical pain, as well as mental. He hardly whimpered when Chewie shot him, made no sound when beating his own injury, but most of all it was his reaction to Snoke's Force lightning which got me thinking. In RotJ, Luke, who was no coward, screamed like a animal when the Emperor tried to cook him with Force lightning. Yet you could actually see Kylo biting back a scream when Snoke hit him with it. That boy has suffered. Not only was Snoke psychologically abusive, he was physically abusive as well. Kylo, not Rey, is the real victim here.
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 11:09 am

My running theory for a while has been that TROS was always meant to focus on Ben's relationship with his mother in the way TFA and TLJ focused on Han (the father) and Luke (the teacher) respectively. Hearing about the potential of Leia training with Luke in a flashback while pregnant and Rey using her lightsaber later has certainly bolstered that. I'm thinking the Force healing power in the leaks may, in fact, be Leia's speciality and something she is in the process of teaching Rey when TROS opens. Rey using Leia's technique to save her son in the end (possibly with Force ghost Leia's help) would be a very satisfying conclusion to Leia's story arc. It also paints Leia not as a Jedi master like Luke, but a Force user with her own set of abilities that differs from those of her brother.
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Post by Gemini on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 11:22 am

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:My running theory for a while has been that TROS was always meant to focus on Ben's relationship with his mother in the way TFA and TLJ focused on Han (the father) and Luke (the teacher) respectively. Hearing about the potential of Leia training with Luke in a flashback while pregnant and Rey using her lightsaber later has certainly bolstered that. I'm thinking the Force healing power in the leaks may, in fact, be Leia's speciality and something she is in the process of teaching Rey when TROS opens. Rey using Leia's technique to save her son in the end (possibly with Force ghost Leia's help) would be a very satisfying conclusion to Leia's story arc. It also paints Leia not as a Jedi master like Luke, but a Force user with her own set of abilities that differs from those of her brother.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Carrie did originally say that the last one was her time to shine and that she couldn't wait for it.
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 11:40 am

@Gemini wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:My running theory for a while has been that TROS was always meant to focus on Ben's relationship with his mother in the way TFA and TLJ focused on Han (the father) and Luke (the teacher) respectively. Hearing about the potential of Leia training with Luke in a flashback while pregnant and Rey using her lightsaber later has certainly bolstered that. I'm thinking the Force healing power in the leaks may, in fact, be Leia's speciality and something she is in the process of teaching Rey when TROS opens. Rey using Leia's technique to save her son in the end (possibly with Force ghost Leia's help) would be a very satisfying conclusion to Leia's story arc. It also paints Leia not as a Jedi master like Luke, but a Force user with her own set of abilities that differs from those of her brother.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Carrie did originally say that the last one was her time to shine and that she couldn't wait for it.
@Gemini
I see patterns everywhere, but this just... makes sense. It's a way to give Leia a powerful story arc without having Leia herself be on-screen (symbols, flashbacks). So Leia is introduced training Rey in some of her own techniques (not lightsaber stuff), Rey probably struggles with it because her forte is combat skills. On Pasaana she pulls out the technique in a moment of peril and heals this creature and then everything is brought full-circle when she uses the technique alongside Leia's Force ghost to heal Ben after his sacrifice.

Kathleen Kennedy said a while back that IX was supposed to be Leia's movie, and I truly do not believe Carrie's passing changed that if they were able to construct an arc for her.
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Post by Teo oswald on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 12:09 pm

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 Tumblr_pxo3dh58RX1ultk62o3_400

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 Tumblr_pxo3dh58RX1ultk62o2_400

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 Tumblr_pxo3dh58RX1ultk62o1_540

Snoke’s torture parallel

Snoke Comic & The Last Jedi
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Post by Gemini on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 12:13 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@Gemini wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:My running theory for a while has been that TROS was always meant to focus on Ben's relationship with his mother in the way TFA and TLJ focused on Han (the father) and Luke (the teacher) respectively. Hearing about the potential of Leia training with Luke in a flashback while pregnant and Rey using her lightsaber later has certainly bolstered that. I'm thinking the Force healing power in the leaks may, in fact, be Leia's speciality and something she is in the process of teaching Rey when TROS opens. Rey using Leia's technique to save her son in the end (possibly with Force ghost Leia's help) would be a very satisfying conclusion to Leia's story arc. It also paints Leia not as a Jedi master like Luke, but a Force user with her own set of abilities that differs from those of her brother.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Carrie did originally say that the last one was her time to shine and that she couldn't wait for it.
@Gemini
I see patterns everywhere, but this just... makes sense. It's a way to give Leia a powerful story arc without having Leia herself be on-screen (symbols, flashbacks). So Leia is introduced training Rey in some of her own techniques (not lightsaber stuff), Rey probably struggles with it because her forte is combat skills. On Pasaana she pulls out the technique in a moment of peril and heals this creature and then everything is brought full-circle when she uses the technique alongside Leia's Force ghost to heal Ben after his sacrifice.

Kathleen Kennedy said a while back that IX was supposed to be Leia's movie, and I truly do not believe Carrie's passing changed that if they were able to construct an arc for her.
@FrolickingFizzgig

It does make sense for it to be about Leias connection with characters, for sure. I also don't believe that changed either.

It's just a shame she never got to see it.

I remember being pretty sad hearing that she said that back just before she died.
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Post by Teo oswald on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 12:16 pm

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 074d69fd9e588902d87beabe9a12680581077b5d
Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 7271561ac5e19290bfefcef923a02838451157c0

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 B79ae008f98140bf6f90d2efa15d42d6babd0337
Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 8d2fc6b3a7f371618e5f783f973a274711c34439

Bendemption!!
Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 30 Ac0c83a56faa91cde4c009d7bd57e5a6c8897b54

I thought that the last image was connected, but it is quite another thing Sad
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Post by SW_Heroine_Journey on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 1:22 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@Gemini wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:My running theory for a while has been that TROS was always meant to focus on Ben's relationship with his mother in the way TFA and TLJ focused on Han (the father) and Luke (the teacher) respectively. Hearing about the potential of Leia training with Luke in a flashback while pregnant and Rey using her lightsaber later has certainly bolstered that. I'm thinking the Force healing power in the leaks may, in fact, be Leia's speciality and something she is in the process of teaching Rey when TROS opens. Rey using Leia's technique to save her son in the end (possibly with Force ghost Leia's help) would be a very satisfying conclusion to Leia's story arc. It also paints Leia not as a Jedi master like Luke, but a Force user with her own set of abilities that differs from those of her brother.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Carrie did originally say that the last one was her time to shine and that she couldn't wait for it.
@Gemini
I see patterns everywhere, but this just... makes sense. It's a way to give Leia a powerful story arc without having Leia herself be on-screen (symbols, flashbacks). So Leia is introduced training Rey in some of her own techniques (not lightsaber stuff), Rey probably struggles with it because her forte is combat skills. On Pasaana she pulls out the technique in a moment of peril and heals this creature and then everything is brought full-circle when she uses the technique alongside Leia's Force ghost to heal Ben after his sacrifice.

Kathleen Kennedy said a while back that IX was supposed to be Leia's movie, and I truly do not believe Carrie's passing changed that if they were able to construct an arc for her.
@FrolickingFizzgig

I'm craving this story beat now! Very Happy Smile Love it! I hope so very much it occurs!
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 2:18 pm

@Gemini wrote:Also, not to sure how I feel about Rey Skywalker (non relation) in regards to Ben and his redemption? Rey Skywalker indicates that the Rise of Skywalker is about someone taking the Skywalker name out of respect, not about  Kylo redemption?

Just makes zero sense! Mad

Unless it means both?
@Gemini
Star Wars titles always have multiple interpretations. Return of the Jedi refers to Anakin emerging from the shadow of Vader and Luke's declaration to restore the Jedi. The Phantom Menace plays with the audience being aware that Vader is going to be born from within Anakin, Darth Maul chasing the party until his defeat and Chancellor Palpatine secretly being Darth Sideus. The Rise of Skywalker was never just going to refer to Ben Solo, imho. I really never understood the single-minded insistence that it had to. Im the context of the leaks (which we don't even know are accurate yet) it will refer to at least three things: Ben Solo's redemption and resurrection, Rey the nobody (or Palpatine) taking on the Skywalker name so it doesn't die out within the future canon of Star Wars and the Skywalker ghosts rising up to destroy Palpatine's spirit within the Force once and for all.
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Post by Gemini on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 3:39 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@Gemini wrote:Also, not to sure how I feel about Rey Skywalker (non relation) in regards to Ben and his redemption? Rey Skywalker indicates that the Rise of Skywalker is about someone taking the Skywalker name out of respect, not about  Kylo redemption?

Just makes zero sense! Mad

Unless it means both?
@Gemini
Star Wars titles always have multiple interpretations. Return of the Jedi refers to Anakin emerging from the shadow of Vader and Luke's declaration to restore the Jedi. The Phantom Menace plays with the audience being aware that Vader is going to be born from within Anakin, Darth Maul chasing the party until his defeat and Chancellor Palpatine secretly being Darth Sideus. The Rise of Skywalker was never just going to refer to Ben Solo, imho. I really never understood the single-minded insistence that it had to. Im the context of the leaks (which we don't even know are accurate yet) it will refer to at least three things: Ben Solo's redemption and resurrection, Rey the nobody (or Palpatine) taking on the Skywalker name so it doesn't die out within the future canon of Star Wars and the Skywalker ghosts rising up to destroy Palpatine's spirit within the Force once and for all.
@FrolickingFizzgig




True, they do have multiple meanings usually.


Do you think it may link in with palpatine possibly giving rise to the Skywalkers as hinted in the prequels as well? Do you think it may be explored at all?


@SW_Heroine_Journey wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@Gemini wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:My running theory for a while has been that TROS was always meant to focus on Ben's relationship with his mother in the way TFA and TLJ focused on Han (the father) and Luke (the teacher) respectively. Hearing about the potential of Leia training with Luke in a flashback while pregnant and Rey using her lightsaber later has certainly bolstered that. I'm thinking the Force healing power in the leaks may, in fact, be Leia's speciality and something she is in the process of teaching Rey when TROS opens. Rey using Leia's technique to save her son in the end (possibly with Force ghost Leia's help) would be a very satisfying conclusion to Leia's story arc. It also paints Leia not as a Jedi master like Luke, but a Force user with her own set of abilities that differs from those of her brother.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Carrie did originally say that the last one was her time to shine and that she couldn't wait for it.
@Gemini
I see patterns everywhere, but this just... makes sense. It's a way to give Leia a powerful story arc without having Leia herself be on-screen (symbols, flashbacks). So Leia is introduced training Rey in some of her own techniques (not lightsaber stuff), Rey probably struggles with it because her forte is combat skills. On Pasaana she pulls out the technique in a moment of peril and heals this creature and then everything is brought full-circle when she uses the technique alongside Leia's Force ghost to heal Ben after his sacrifice.

Kathleen Kennedy said a while back that IX was supposed to be Leia's movie, and I truly do not believe Carrie's passing changed that if they were able to construct an arc for her.
@FrolickingFizzgig

I'm craving this story beat now!  Very Happy Smile Love it!  I hope so very much it occurs!
@SW_Heroine_Journey

Lol, this is also the only way I think I could enjoy that moment.
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Post by OrionStars on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 5:23 pm

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@OrionStars wrote:
@SanghaRen wrote:I just read very quickly the Snoke comics on my phone. I just could not wait to be at home tonight to read it. I love it. Probably should go in the novel thread, but I can't access it right now and there are very interesting bits and pieces in it. Nothing spoilery, but it does make you want to know more. And the drawing style is nice. I will put spoilers on my highlights, just for the people who want to read it first.

Spoiler:

- Snoke knows about Dagobah. How??
- When Ben expresses surprise at Snoke seemingly having respect for Luke, he answers that Luke has earned his respect and his fear (how??) and adds "If I had your uncle by my side instead of you, the galaxy would have been mine a long time ago." What a nasty piece of s***.
- Snoke is physically violent with Ben - which we knew even if we hadn't seen it -, he punches him in the face when he dares trying to discuss his order to leave the mask behind.
- Ben does strike down Luke in the cave but not his parents. He lashes out at a tree instead and destroys the cave (Rey can't go there, now). Snoke is happy because he shows anger and determination ("you won't need other apprentices" he tells Snoke after he tells him that he might have like to take other apprentices here), but that probably also showed him that Ben would still rather destroy something else as his parents hence the disguised order to kill Han in TFA.

The profile at the end is also playing with the audience "All of these things are a mystery. Perhaps they will always be." Hear the fans screaming (me included)?
@SanghaRen



Wow, they really did it, they chose to explore Ben's past in the comic instead of showing it on the big screen for the worldwide audience to see. Now we will have to watch the past of Poe (a supporting character in TFA) and his love interest in TROS, the final movie of Ben's family saga. Yeet.
@OrionStars
There's nothing in this comic that wasn't literally in TLJ or directly inferable from TLJ. I can't even call this exploring Ben's past, it's just a look deeper into his relationship with Snoke. There are multiple scenes in TLJ in which Snoke speaks to Ben exactly like this and way more detail on how Ben's history with Luke shaped his inability to walk away from Snoke. This is how abusers operate. It all ties together, really. As it should.

Poe's past and his relationship with Zorii is probably going to be largely comic relief with a touch of drama surrounding Poe's life before he joined the Resistance. In fact, knowing what we do about the Rey, Kylo and Palpatine side of things I wouldn't be surprised if the Resistance gang (+ the droids) had to support a lot of the levity in the script. That doesn't mean they'll only have comedy and action to play (I'm sure Finn will have more emotional resonance in his relationship with Jannah, another ex storm trooper), but the drama will have to be divided appropriately. John Williams did mention that there would be some comedy between Rey and Kylo so I guess we'll see what that means.
@FrolickingFizzgig


I wish we could have more of the relationship between Leia and her real son Ben Solo in TLJ, why she gave him up, why their family fell apart, etc, but no they forced us to see the relationship between Leia and her surrogate son Poe plus how he was struggling to take Leia's role instead, it already annoyed me in TLJ, a character who was supposed to die in TFA but the actor who played him was hot so yeahhh, the rest is history.
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Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Wed 11 Sep 2019, 8:11 pm

@OrionStars wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@OrionStars wrote:
@SanghaRen wrote:I just read very quickly the Snoke comics on my phone. I just could not wait to be at home tonight to read it. I love it. Probably should go in the novel thread, but I can't access it right now and there are very interesting bits and pieces in it. Nothing spoilery, but it does make you want to know more. And the drawing style is nice. I will put spoilers on my highlights, just for the people who want to read it first.

Spoiler:

- Snoke knows about Dagobah. How??
- When Ben expresses surprise at Snoke seemingly having respect for Luke, he answers that Luke has earned his respect and his fear (how??) and adds "If I had your uncle by my side instead of you, the galaxy would have been mine a long time ago." What a nasty piece of s***.
- Snoke is physically violent with Ben - which we knew even if we hadn't seen it -, he punches him in the face when he dares trying to discuss his order to leave the mask behind.
- Ben does strike down Luke in the cave but not his parents. He lashes out at a tree instead and destroys the cave (Rey can't go there, now). Snoke is happy because he shows anger and determination ("you won't need other apprentices" he tells Snoke after he tells him that he might have like to take other apprentices here), but that probably also showed him that Ben would still rather destroy something else as his parents hence the disguised order to kill Han in TFA.

The profile at the end is also playing with the audience "All of these things are a mystery. Perhaps they will always be." Hear the fans screaming (me included)?
@SanghaRen



Wow, they really did it, they chose to explore Ben's past in the comic instead of showing it on the big screen for the worldwide audience to see. Now we will have to watch the past of Poe (a supporting character in TFA) and his love interest in TROS, the final movie of Ben's family saga. Yeet.
@OrionStars
There's nothing in this comic that wasn't literally in TLJ or directly inferable from TLJ. I can't even call this exploring Ben's past, it's just a look deeper into his relationship with Snoke. There are multiple scenes in TLJ in which Snoke speaks to Ben exactly like this and way more detail on how Ben's history with Luke shaped his inability to walk away from Snoke. This is how abusers operate. It all ties together, really. As it should.

Poe's past and his relationship with Zorii is probably going to be largely comic relief with a touch of drama surrounding Poe's life before he joined the Resistance. In fact, knowing what we do about the Rey, Kylo and Palpatine side of things I wouldn't be surprised if the Resistance gang (+ the droids) had to support a lot of the levity in the script. That doesn't mean they'll only have comedy and action to play (I'm sure Finn will have more emotional resonance in his relationship with Jannah, another ex storm trooper), but the drama will have to be divided appropriately. John Williams did mention that there would be some comedy between Rey and Kylo so I guess we'll see what that means.
@FrolickingFizzgig


I wish we could have more of the relationship between Leia and her real son Ben Solo in TLJ, why she gave him up, why their family fell apart, etc, but no they forced us to see the relationship between Leia and her surrogate son Poe plus how he was struggling to take Leia's role instead, it already annoyed me in TLJ, a character who was supposed to die in TFA but the actor who played him was hot so yeahhh, the rest is history.
@OrionStars
I don't think it ever would have been the plan to explore Leia's past or relationship with Ben in TLJ because the writers entered the ST with the purpose of making a film about Han, a film about Luke and then a film about Leia. Leia's was meant to be the conclusion (and I believe it still will be based on what JJ and others have said).

I agree that not killing off Poe in TFA was a mistake, but not for the same reason as you. It damaged Finn's whole story the most, imo. He was meant to sort of take Poe's place as a Resistance hero climbing the ranks, but then Oscar asked to stick around so JJ extended his role. Finn ende up having what was unique about his story arc (Stormtrooper past/Resistance her) stripped away by pairing him up with Poe. Heck, Rian realized this too and made Rose to compensate, but Poe is always a step ahead of Finn so it feels as though Finn is often treading old water.
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