Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors

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Post by spacebaby45678 on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 2:21 am




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Post by Saracene on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 3:02 am

Kylo’s actions in this leak make no goddamn sense lol. Like, his strategy for converting Rey to the dark side is to constantly antagonise her, taunt her with the details of her parents’ tragic deaths, and make her fight him for his Wayfinder after he destroys the second Wayfinder... so wait I thought the idea was to get Rey to Palpatine, not stopping her from going to Palpatine? Instead Kylo’s like, you’ll have to kill me to get the Wayfinder Rey! Maybe Grandpa Palpatine could have given him some tips on how to seduce people to the dark side before he sent him off.

And Palpatine’s master plan was to basically wait until Kylo bumped off Snoke and started looking for the dark side trinkets? That’s totally the kind of stuff one can plan in advance.

Don’t even get me started on Hux who not only leaks info to the Resistance but also shows up in person to save our heroes.
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Post by SanghaRen on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 4:27 am

I would not base my theory on Ben Solo’s character development on AD. Even if he has been told the big lines, the story might have evolved and I doubt he can complain about it. He’s not to that level of power. Plus he has said in numerous interviews, not only SW-related, that he leaves the story up to the writers and directors and sticks to his acting. He doesn’t really take ownership of his characters. He also mentioned selecting some roles based on the directors. And let’s face it, his decision to take the role was probably partly money-based. His fear to take on the role seemed more related to being stuck with SW forever, which he has successfully avoided so far thanks to other roles and somehow managing to escape promotional duties unlike his less fortunate cast mates. I am not saying he doesn’t care about Ben Solo/Kylo Ren, his acting performance speaks for itself, but I think that if JJ would destroy the character story-wise, AD would play along because that’s what the story is.

In general, the cast that is promoting the movie is not going to say “it s***” during promotion. They’ll say that later 😁

We shall see in less than 3 months what JJ cooked up. In any case, since it’s being promoted as the ultimate closing chapter of the Skywalker saga, it will not please everyone who had 8 movies and so many years to build steadfast headcanons on how it should end.
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Post by OrionStars on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 5:23 am

@special_cases wrote:So your comment about ViewerAnon is the same comment I made in first place? He confirmed that he heard the same things but not all of them. He is legit, that's it. He is not obligated to tell anybody any details, and if he was unsure he would have stayed silent.

There was a leak before that full threatment about Endgame. I have no idea what it has to do with people believing something else or other fake leaks. That leak wasn't verified so people don't believe it. Go on Reddit and you will find it.

The ending of GoT leaked a year before the release. Full season - no, but ending leaked.

We know what was in RJ's draft because RJ told us. The leak from January included it.

If I understand correctly, you're trying to say that big movie projects never have earlier leaks about major plotpoints of movies?  
@special_cases



Eh, I don't want to derail the thread by spamming the other films' leak history anymore. But from my experience, MCU fans were so hell-bent on believing a lot of false leaks because those leaks came from various trustable sources in the past. Surprisingly, the only one who gave them true leak was a newly made account.

The same can be said about GOT 8, even though there was a leaker who mentioned Dany's death earlier but he wasn't sure about it either to the point that he made 2 threads to celebrate Dany's survival then he made another thread just to tell people that his friend had changed his tone and told him that Dany wouldn't survive. And the leaker didn't know among the other candidates, who would end up on the throne in the final ending.

I'm open up to any leak and willing to discuss them because I don't want to waste my time to show up in the theatre for a sh*tty movie so I want to know all spoilers. But who should I trust when even Paxis himself doesn't feel confident in his leaks at all to the point that he put out a hypocritical disclaimer before he goes around and patrols anyone who dares to point out something wrong in his leaks in the sub he's moderating.
And don't even get me start on V.A, there were just a few bullet points in JP leaks but that dude acted like JP wrote a 1000 pages novel. There wasn't any point left for him to not be aware of.
Besides, both Paxis and Jason insisted that Rey Palpatine will be the heart of the story but now Pablo has debunked it, Pablo also said he had never heard about the dyad, which basically debunks not only Paxis, Jason but also Bespin, I guess we're now lost in the leak maze.


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Post by Lovely_Rose on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 5:41 am

Yup if Rey Palpatine is wrong then so are a lot of the other things MSW and JP are passing around. That one fact moved a lot of the so-called plot and scenes they laid out.

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Post by 12 Parsnips on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 6:05 am

Remember the Rey Solo debacle? It was based on the information the Lando tells Poe and Finn something that shocks them. That’s apparently all the info they had that made our leakers believe in Rey Solo. Rey Solo was the only reasonable solution, right? What other info could Lando possibly have?!?!

And that’s why I take these leaks with a grain of salt. I’m sure there’s truth in some of the basic information, but I highly distrust the interpretations we’re getting based on the “truth.” Since I don’t know where the actual tidbit of truth ends and the interpretation begins, I have to just take a step back, look at what I already know from official sources and the previous 8 movies, and work from that instead.
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Post by whisperingwillow on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 7:50 am

Here is my thought on the leaks as of now: the leaks may have some truth to them and explain why others like VA and Bespin and MSW have heard some of the same stuff. However, my guess is not all of them are correct because some so it will be JPs and all the people the leaks passed through bias. Also some could simply just be speculation based off basic plot points they know. My guess is if the person leaking to them all this info and it was one hundred percent correct would be extremely high up in LucasFilm or Bad Robot and would be easily found. More than likely it is a pieced together story based off little things people have heard here and there and maybe seen a storyboard for.
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Post by Night Huntress on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 7:52 am

is it me, or was it so much more fun discussing and theorizing about the leaks for TLJ?

the more "leaks" we get for TROS the more indifferent I feel about it and just want the movie to be out and done with... Nope
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 7:56 am

I remember years ago when someone 'leaked' the entire script for Th Dark Knight, which was 2008's most anticipated film.
It was awful. Batman fans were horrified.

Then when the film was released, it turned out the entire 'leak' was FAF.
Some bits of the real script were leaked but only a very few and right before the release. The SW films have security so tight that half the cast aren't aware of all the plot lines. And those that aren't are under strict contracts to keep mum.

If there's one thing that convinces me it's a load of rubbish it's the Hux as a 'good guy' scenario. This is the man who oversaw the creation of Starkiller and urged Snoke for permission to use it to destroy an entire system of five planets and billions of lives purely as a d*** waving exercise. Even Kylo was sickened by this.

If anyone is going to turn on the FO, it sure as hell isn't going to be Brendon Hux's son.
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Post by giaciak2 on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 8:04 am

@SkyStar wrote:New detailed leaks from JP on reddit - I now cannot hear anyone over the sound of Rey stabbing Kylo and then healing him. Why. So bad.
@SkyStar

Can you share this leaks?
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Post by bashfulblueeyes3 on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 8:22 am

I think the leaks would have been better in a bullet point format. I think what Jedi Paxis is doing is putting them into a story format. He is using his "leaks" and filling in the empty spaces with his own bias. The tone of everything coming out is anti Kylo/Ben. If these leaks are "true", he has said that some it is second and third source, so there are many facts that can be misconstrued. Also, I see that many people keep asking hm for more information on Reyo/Kylo or relationships and Ben living. Keep in mind if you ask him these things, you area going to get a negative answer. He doesn't not like shipping, Reylo, or it seems Kylo Ren. His answers come out is very negative.

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Post by Kylo Rey on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 9:16 am

@Night Huntress wrote:is it me, or was it so much more fun discussing and theorizing about the leaks for TLJ?

the more "leaks" we get for TROS the more indifferent I feel about it and just want the movie to be out and done with... Nope
@Night Huntress

I know what you mean. There’s a lot more riding on this movie than TLJ - last movie of the trilogy, last chapter of the saga. Realistically, Kylo was never going to die in TLJ (it’s the middle movie!), there’s a far bigger chance that he dies here. It’s starting to deflate my hype. When the D23 trailer came out, there was a lot of excitement and enthusiasm (remember Dark Rey? Seems like a million years ago now), which lasted for a few days before JP leaked his rough outline. Now everyone has gone back to second guessing themselves. Even if fake, he’s sowed a lot of uncertainty in the fandom.

If these leaks are real, then I have no idea what the heck JJ was thinking or why Kathleen Kennedy greenlit this script in the first place, especially when she’s fired people in the past pretty quickly when the story has not been up to par. Just the idea of a Palpatine carrrying on the legacy of the Skywalkers after they’re all six feet under, including Kylo Ren who gets a last minute redemption, and adopting the Skywalker name, makes me nauseous. What an incredibly contrived way to achieve the title of the movie.

Another thing that bugs me about the leaks - it reminds me a lot of Game of Thrones, and the incredibly cynical and disrespectful way D&D wrote a lot of the characters, particularly in S8. Same kind of vibe. Like Kylo is the villain yes, but the movies (both TFA and TLJ), have treated him with empathy, are cognizant of his conflict and struggles, as well as his family legacy. The leaks seem designed to crap on his character from a height, and also destroy the legacy of the OT3 in the process. He doesn’t have any agency, and it’s not even Skywalker family drama, it’s more like Palpatine family drama. It’s vomit inducing.

Also, now that I think about it, why on earth bring Palpatine back if you’re just gonna have Kylo be the Big Bad for most of the movie anyway? LOL.


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Post by SW_Heroine_Journey on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 9:19 am

@bashfulblueeyes3 wrote:I think the leaks would have been better in a bullet point format. I think what Jedi Paxis is doing is putting them into a story format. He is using his "leaks" and filling in the empty spaces with his own bias. The tone of everything coming out is anti Kylo/Ben. If these leaks are "true", he has said that some it is second and third source, so there are many facts that can be misconstrued. Also, I see that many people keep asking hm for more information on Reyo/Kylo or relationships and Ben living. Keep in mind if you ask him these things, you area going to get a negative answer. He doesn't not like shipping, Reylo, or it seems Kylo Ren. His answers come out is very negative.
@bashfulblueeyes3

Well said! This is with both JP and MSW/JW...if they released only the information they have (I do not doubt they receive something, but I don't know the validity) without a narrative or trying to tie their information together, that will be one thing; however, they don't. They have negative biases, and a definite lack of awareness about the fem gaze/heroine's journey, which removes their credibility.

I know one thing - I am definitely seeking out spoiler reviews when the review embargo ends because of too much investment, plus if I see drama for things that it seems is not occurring (mindful I have not seen the movie - but) I am stepping in. lol

For those negative about the movie now, based on leaks, which we have no idea if they are credible or not, I recommend be careful to yourselves. It's not good for the nervous system. Plus, I it's not fun, when this should be fun. If the movie turns out to be awful, that's on LF - we still have fanfic and art!

PS I don't care if Rey is a Palpatine - I just hope it's done well for the Heroine's Journey, Reylo and Bendemption. Otherwise, my AMC A-List is not being used to the max! Very Happy Smile

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Post by OrionStars on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 9:23 am

@bashfulblueeyes3 wrote:I think the leaks would have been better in a bullet point format.  I think what Jedi Paxis is doing is putting them into a story format.  He is using his "leaks" and filling in the empty spaces with his own bias. The tone of everything coming out is anti Kylo/Ben.  If these leaks are "true", he has said that some it is second and third source, so there are many facts that can be misconstrued.  Also, I see that many people keep asking hm for more information on Reyo/Kylo or relationships and Ben living.  Keep in mind if you ask him these things, you area going to get a negative answer.  He doesn't not like shipping, Reylo, or it seems Kylo Ren.  His answers come out is very negative.
@bashfulblueeyes3

Agree, there is something really strange with Paxis. But a lot of user in the reddit sub is worshipping his leak now because he's the moderator of the leak sub anw and he has more power than Renisthekey and FOOSLS. In the past, even those leakers who actually saw the films couldn't memorize every single detail and then broke everything down to the bone in multi-threads on reddit. They're not fanfic writers on AO3 and they wouldn't do multi chapters leak for people to read. A few days ago, I saw a lot of reddit users talking about the idea that Rey might use her healing power to save Kylo in the previous leak thread on reddit, then today Paxis immediately came up with chapter 2 of his leak, in which he described that Rey stabs Kylo while he grieves for his mother's death, then she heals him later to save him just to prove that she's a saint who isn't like him. This is a really important plot point which is a turntable to both Rey and Kylo but he just coincidently forgot to include it in the first leak thread that he used to give away the important plot points of TROS?
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Post by Lovely_Rose on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 9:51 am

It also conveniently allows him to remove any possibility of Rey saving Kylo in the third act.

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Post by motherofpearl1 on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 10:00 am

Ultimately Rey being a Palpatine doesn't bother me so much as Ben dying. SW is supposed to be about hope. If Ben /Kylo simply dies and Rey is left alone it's as depressing as hell. The Resistance, as I've said before, will disband after the war, and although Rey has friends with Finn and Rose as a couple, possibly with their own kids, she'll be on the outside so to speak, especially as she's the only one Force sensitive.
And it'll make all the sacrifices of the OC pointless. Han died to save his son. Luke died atoning for the damage he did to Ben. How Leia dies is unknown but I'm sure they'll find a purposeful way, to honour Carrie. Ironically when Luke says 'generations live in you now' it's supposed to be Rey, but it sounds more applicable to Ben.
Han and Leia's son, Luke's nephew, Anakin's grandson.....he is truly the last of the line. To simply kill him off just so Rey can be the last Jedi left is awful storytelling and it'll actually make me dislike her. I already briefly found her annoying at the scene in TLJ when she slammed the door on Ben - although it was probably more due to Adam's acting than anything!
I don't want LF to do that to either of them.
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Post by Kylo Rey on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 10:05 am

Lmao!

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 5 A5772d10

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 5 A7f86310

Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 5 F64f2010
Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors - Page 5 A168ea10

And remember, JJ consulted George on TROS.
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Post by AhsokaTano on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 10:09 am

Am prepared for anything in this film and still believe we are getting reylo and bendemption . JP does have a disclaimer at the beginning of the leaks and isn’t sure if this is the current script or Treverrow’s. So he’s not sure . I feel with all the media that’s been released since the new trilogy including other Disney media ( especially this year ) that they’ve been hinting/reinforcing big time certain ideas and balance resurrection and union of opposites are just some of these ideas. They’ve even released the count Dooku book now in play form as a script and that hints big time at possibility of someone returning from death ( Kai ) if his former female apprentice Asaaj wants this . I think it’s still going to happen and I feel even more optimistic after reading the recent Disney Loki novel because again like lion king , Aladdin which had similar scenes and themes , there’s a lot of parallels in there( enemies to lovers and vice versa, force vampires , resurrection, Prince and pauper tropes, Amora being like the water bearer for Loki and quenching his thirst and only other being that understands him because she is like him ) and goes into basic myths , Shakespeare and story telling. Despite him ending( temporarily) alone it does reinforce how this isn’t necessarily set in stone and you can change what you think your destiny is ie how you always have a choice and can be what you want to be and have your happily ever after .
There’s always hope .
Why are Disney highlighting this stuff if it means nothing ? Kylo and Rey said to each other you’re not alone , neither are you as they touched hands . I think their union is inevitable and they will get it right and no amount of wishful thinking from some fans will prevent this (together they are the balance ).
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Post by Night Huntress on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 10:35 am

@Kylo Rey

exactly, it's like watching a TV-Show and at the first seasons you root for a couple to come together, but they overdue it with the "will they won't they" so that by the end you won't care anymore? Anyone knows that feeling or is it just me? That's how I feel about TROS at the moment.

I'm not married to any ideas - but I want a good organic story...chasing after a McGuffin and last-minute redemptions or change of hearts is NOT a good story imo. It's lazy and poor writing.

OT: I was listening to the "What the Force" podcast's latest episode. And they discussed the idea that instead of Rey being related to Palpatine, he is the "evil old Wizard" looking for a bride (metaphorically or even literally if he is able to restore himself into a younger body). Maybe it sounds crazy but I love the idea- it would be much more interesting for sure. Him making a proposal to Rey but much more twisted than Kylo/Ben in TLJ.
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Post by nickandnora on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 10:46 am

I'm not sure if I'm blind or going crazy or something (because I can't find the reference to this anymore), but did someone say that JediPaxis made the disclaimer somewhere that he really can't be sure if this is from Trevorrow's script or not?

If so, that's his weirdest, most telling admission to date. It would suggest he doesn't even know where his information is actually coming from and that it's not from active production. Is someone just randomly messaging him? It's also a convenient "out" for him if a ton of his information ends up being wrong. That is, if he's not just completely lying, knowingly. Very, very odd.

The funny thing is, I think the most likely story option surrounding the whole Rey stabbing Kylo/Healing him is somewhere in between what MSW/JW originally posited and what JP is probably erroneously insinuating: That Kylo is "possessed" by Palpatine, asks Rey to kill him, she does, and then brings him back to life. This would be an Act III thing for sure. I'm not saying that IS what happens, but in between what they are and aren't saying, that seems to be the thing that makes the most sense.

I can actually see Rey doing what Paxis says in Act II (sort of, if I squint at it) but there needs to be both fallout, payoff, and massive self-reflection as a result. There seems to be a lack of that in his leaks.


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Post by californiagirl on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 11:03 am

I get that JJ is a filmmaker with flaws, but I swear we've straight-up vilified him, turning him into this absolute caricature who never cares about anything or any of his actors ever, someone who is beyond apathy into almost active hatred for what he's making. The other thing we're not asking is why these creative choices would be made. Even bad things have their reasons behind them. There's fear of JJ's love of fanservice, but which sizable group is he trying to make happy, what group of fans are being served, what's the intended goal? Nor does LF let directors do whatever they want, as evidenced by the parade of fallen filmmakers in their wake (Gareth, L&M, Colin, even Trank was attached to a project early on.)

Just because they're trying to promote a thing doesn't mean anyone involved has to look happy or confident about it, re:GOT S8. The cast didn't even try to hide their lack of enthusiasm, their slight horror, certainly an element of dread. D&D said they would be very drunk and far from the internet when the last two episodes aired. It was all honestly kind of uncomfortable and sad. It's been nice to see the TROS group so chipper in comparison.

And this leaker is still going? Am I the only one who finds this more than a little absurd?

Really though, the idea that Colin's scripts exist makes this so much more fascinating. Do we ever get the full story? Do I have to wait 20 years for it? Trevorrow: A Star Wars Story. Smile
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Post by Mila95 on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 12:56 pm

@Kylo Rey wrote:
@Night Huntress wrote:is it me, or was it so much more fun discussing and theorizing about the leaks for TLJ?

the more "leaks" we get for TROS the more indifferent I feel about it and just want the movie to be out and done with... Nope
@Night Huntress

I know what you mean. There’s a lot more riding on this movie than TLJ - last movie of the trilogy, last chapter of the saga. Realistically, Kylo was never going to die in TLJ (it’s the middle movie!), there’s a far bigger chance that he dies here. It’s starting to deflate my hype. When the D23 trailer came out, there was a lot of excitement and enthusiasm (remember Dark Rey? Seems like a million years ago now), which lasted for a few days before JP leaked his rough outline. Now everyone has gone back to second guessing themselves. Even if fake, he’s sowed a lot of uncertainty in the fandom.

If these leaks are real, then I have no idea what the heck JJ was thinking or why Kathleen Kennedy greenlit this script in the first place, especially when she’s fired people in the past pretty quickly when the story has not been up to par. Just the idea of a Palpatine carrrying on the legacy of the Skywalkers after they’re all six feet under, including Kylo Ren who gets a last minute redemption, and adopting the Skywalker name, makes me nauseous. What an incredibly contrived way to achieve the title of the movie.

Another thing that bugs me about the leaks - it reminds me a lot of Game of Thrones, and the incredibly cynical and disrespectful way D&D wrote a lot of the characters, particularly in S8. Same kind of vibe. Like Kylo is the villain yes, but the movies (both TFA and TLJ), have treated him with empathy, are cognizant of his conflict and struggles, as well as his family legacy. The leaks seem designed to crap on his character from a height, and also destroy the legacy of the OT3 in the process. He doesn’t have any agency, and it’s not even Skywalker family drama, it’s more like Palpatine family drama. It’s vomit inducing.

Also, now that I think about it, why on earth bring Palpatine back if you’re just gonna have Kylo be the Big Bad for most of the movie anyway? LOL.
@Kylo Rey

Yeah if they're true then they would have killed a Skywalker /Solo in every single movie and 2 in the last one. It's kinda hard not to find that depressing and totally tragic in a way Rey as someone who isn't a Skywalker can't really make happier. And yeah the idea of all Skywalkers dead but a Palpatine carrying on their legacy in whatever way is a terrible idea imo, not matter the fact that Rey is a hero. And even Rey's ending doesn't sound happy if you think about it a bit deeper. Her Resistance friends are all paired up and they'll separate to live their own lives when the war is over. I mean I doubt Rey is gonna live with Finn and Rose and be a third wheel for them. Ben was really the one person that's just for her, who cares about her as the number one person in his life which is something Rey never had. Basically sounds like if the leaks are legit, Rey is a copy of Luke and it's not like that guy's life was happy.

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Post by Night Huntress on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 1:11 pm

@Mila95 wrote:I mean I doubt Rey is gonna live with Finn and Rose and be a third wheel for them. Ben was really the one person that's just for her, who cares about her as the number one person in his life which is something Rey never had. Basically sounds like if the leaks are legit, Rey is a copy of Luke and it's not like that guy's life was happy.
@Mila95

yes, she started lonely on a desert planet and (if the leaks are legit) will end-up alone on another desert planet. Well, they do say Star Wars is like poetry - it rhymes.  Now I'm being cynical b**** I know  Razz
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Post by special_cases on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 1:47 pm

@OrionStars I think we shouldn't trust any leaker 100% but dismiss completely leaks supported by 3 sources and VA is taking it too far. Like I can imagine some conspiracies that MSW is feeding other two sources with slightly different versions of his leak or that LF finally decided to plant fake leaks via established leakers in fandom, but it's still conspiracies. I would like to think that LF is that smart but I doubt they care that much. I have my own doubts about JP guy. First of all, it's sort of suspicious that he is now the only mod in SWLeaks. I know that other mods mostly ignored their duties even during TLJ era but I would love to know how exactly and when got full control over this sub. I tried to find some info but didn't find anything significant. Secondly, I know how MSW can have contacts to relevant sources for leaks but how did JP, a Reddit mod, got them? Also it will be great to know who is SorrynotSpartacus. There are a lot suspicious stuff here, but it's hard to dismiss that multiple leakers support each other.
JP is totally filling too many gaps with his own assuming and JP has never been great with hmmm analysis when it comes to the story so that's why his version is different from MSW. We can call MSW dudebro, but it's obvious that he is trying to interpret things with less bias and in more pro-Reylo side because it's very bold to ignore Reylo dynamic since TLJ.
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Post by Lovely_Rose on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 1:50 pm

This won’t be an issue for too much longer. We’re going to get a lot of hints concerning what this film is about in a few weeks. So I would recommend reylos to just go about business as usual until that time.

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