The Rise of Skywalker: Professional Reviews

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Post by motherofpearl1 on Wed 22 Jan 2020, 4:13 pm

I actually wondered for a minute if Dark Rey was a long lost twin sister!
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Post by Birdwoman on Wed 22 Jan 2020, 5:19 pm

I was thinking, Rey will fall to the dark side then a powerful light side user rises. Maybe that will be a handsome man or woman?

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Post by Atenais on Wed 22 Jan 2020, 6:21 pm

@Mila95 wrote:I do get how Luke fans would not have liked it because it's always sad when your favorite character has failed in what they wanted to do and in such a depressed state. But I do think it's the consequences of doing a sequel with the older cast they kinda had to do something to give them a reason to do new movies. I also do think they should have made this new trilogy different enough tho so it's not just Rey doing everything Luke did again and now it's somehow right without giving a reason why it should stick now.

I've also talked about Luke with a few people in my family who are OT fans and also younger Luke fans and they had this huge problem with Luke being "humiliated". Like the thing they kept coming back to was throwing the lightsaber away at the beginning and the drinking green milk thing, not even trying to kill Ben cause they thought he was right about it because they hate him lol. They had this impression that Luke was deliberately mocked and not respected cause he was portrayed in a less than perfect way at times and didn't even care about the development in the movie where he comes back and grows as a person. Idk if this is a popular opinion with Luke fans but it's what I came across in real life.
@Mila95

As many here, I really liked the development of Luke, finally he looked as a real human being and finally I could identify with him. It's about life, we start wishing to be the hero, then the time passes and real life happens. It was nice to see Luke still learning, I found his ending cathartic and very powerful. But people don't like to remember we're mortal, that we can't always be the hero, that real life is hard. People have big problem with ageing, the journey of the hero is only delightful if the hero is stuck in his youth.

Personally, I don't have big problem with Ben's death either, I have problems with its execution, they made his death kinda pointless, anyway, the whole movie was frustrating.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Thu 23 Jan 2020, 1:31 am

Han and Luke both lived years after Star Wars. And they left behind a descendant.
Ben Solo was just 30, and hadn't lived. His death was depressing, and although a lot of people said it was nice he saved the woman he loved, it still irks me that the last Skywalker died saving the last Palpatine. Who mourned him for about five minutes, watched over by the contented ghosts of the uncle whose mistake drove him to the Dark side and the mother who neglected him to advance her career. That was how it seemed to me, and always will, despite repeated arguments from people who loved it. How I wish I could have loved it. But it's destroyed SW for me.

On the TLJ blu ray Rian discussed Luke's reasons for isolating himself, and he said one of them was Luke was concerned that a powerful dark sider could rise to challenge him, which was why he cut himself off from the Force, out of a desire to prevent that. If they'd continued Rian's themes, then the Force finding a balance in Ben and Rey would have brought an end to the eternal conflict between the light and the dark. But now just a single pure light sider is left, it'll start all over again.
They try to say the Force is balanced in Rey, but how can it be when she's just yet another holier than thou Jedi, complete with pure white clothing. And ofy course, virginal.
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Post by Saracene on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 2:25 am

So TRoS now officially has a worse Rotten Tomatoes rating at 52% fresh than The Phantom Menace Laughing Laughing

The Skywalker saga is bookended by its two worst-reviewed films... it's poetry and sith.
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Post by toolonelytosleep on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 4:23 am

@Saracene wrote:So TRoS now officially has a worse Rotten Tomatoes rating at 52% fresh than The Phantom Menace Laughing Laughing

The Skywalker saga is bookended by its two worst-reviewed films... it's poetry and sith.
@Saracene

The audience score hasn't budged from 86% at all (from what I've seen). If the score is genuine and there's no tampering involved, it's interesting how TROS (and TLJ) are divided between the critics and the audience.

But wow, worse than TPM? Twisted Evil At least TPM was the beginning of the prequels and they, arguably, got better by ROTS. It's easier for me to forgive a bad beginning than a bad ending.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 4:36 am

And love or hate the prequels, they had a good plot.
Next to the waste of key characters, Kylo's unforgivable end and Mary Rey Sue, the worst thing about TROS is it's got no plot. There's just an endless series of action sequences and, fun though they are, they get repeatetive.

I saw the destruction of the Death Star scene from A New Hope on YouTube yesterday....forty two years later, it still has the power to move me.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KuKqcfO31is The final scenes from TROS, apart from the all too brief Reylo moments, were in comparison cringe worthy.
And you can't blame the whole ST....both TFA and, TLJ were great.
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Post by vaderito on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 7:37 am

@Saracene wrote:So TRoS now officially has a worse Rotten Tomatoes rating at 52% fresh than The Phantom Menace Laughing Laughing

The Skywalker saga is bookended by its two worst-reviewed films... it's poetry and sith.
@Saracene

aTROSity ismuch worse than TPM so rating is fair but still too high (should be only 7% if you ask me) . Unlike aTROSity, TPM is coherent, it knows what it wants to do. And while execusion may be wonky, there's a clear vision and fantastic universe building.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Sun 26 Jan 2020, 5:43 am

Am I the only one who gets sad looking at posts on this forum before TROS was released?
We were so excited.....Crying or Very sad
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Post by Geralt_Riv on Sun 26 Jan 2020, 7:10 am

@motherofpearl1 wrote:Am I the only one who gets sad looking at posts on this forum before TROS was released?
We were so excited.....Crying or Very sad
@motherofpearl1
Since the spoilers came out there hasn't been much excitement.
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Post by vaderito on Sun 26 Jan 2020, 7:23 am

Agreed, JP spoilers killed enthusiasm.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Sun 26 Jan 2020, 7:45 am

Yes, well I meant before the spoilers!
But even then, a lot of us didn't believe them, because they seemed so badly written.

Over a month after seeing it, I still can't believe what a genuinely bad film it was. I've seen straight to dvd B movies that were better written. The only thing good about it is the acting. Plus Adam.
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Post by snufkin on Mon 27 Jan 2020, 9:53 pm

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Post by Lily Snape on Tue 28 Jan 2020, 12:40 am

@motherofpearl1 wrote:Am I the only one who gets sad looking at posts on this forum before TROS was released?
We were so excited.....Crying or Very sad
@motherofpearl1

I remember writing stuff like, “No way they’ll do that! It’s just bad storytelling.” And it is. It’s bad storytelling in a badly-made movie. TROS is really sloppy and thrown together. If it had treated KMT better and given Ben the ending he deserved, I could have brushed over how bad it was, but it didn’t.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Tue 28 Jan 2020, 2:07 am

Same here. Grit my teeth and bear it.
But the whole thing was a tedious and ridiculous journey towards a completely unnecessary bad ending.

I've had to stop posting on CBR's SW forum, there's so much love for this film, so much hate for Reylo and TLJ and I couldn't engage because you can get banned for answering back. People are entitled to like and hate, but it's so hard to see them insisting that the message of a Palpatine denying her heritage is a good one, and the Skywalkers will live on through Rey.

As a longtime fan, I will never cease to be amazed how many long time fans are accepting of this. L/F and Disney wanted to 'begin anew'. So why keep the Palpatine bloodline going?

Hey guys - the bad guy won, but it's okay, his granddaughter stole the heroes' name so all's well and good.
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Post by reylo1992 on Tue 28 Jan 2020, 4:58 am

@motherofpearl1 wrote:Same here. Grit my teeth and bear it.
But the whole thing was a tedious and ridiculous journey towards a completely unnecessary bad ending.

I've had to stop posting on CBR's SW forum,  there's so much love for this film, so much hate for Reylo and TLJ and I couldn't engage because you can get banned for answering back. People are entitled to like and hate, but it's so hard to see them insisting that the message of a Palpatine denying her heritage is a good one, and the Skywalkers will live on through Rey.

As a longtime fan, I will never cease to be amazed how many long time fans are accepting of this.  L/F and Disney wanted to 'begin anew'. So why keep the Palpatine bloodline going?

Hey guys - the bad guy won, but it's okay, his granddaughter stole the heroes' name so all's well and good.
@motherofpearl1

I am not as bitter as you are but there is definitely something not right with the ending of that movie. The worst part of it is that actually a lot of ideas have the potential to be meaningful and were intended to be. In itself, the idea of Rey rising above her dark legacy, Skywalkers correcting with the heir of their ennemy what they did wrong with their own heir and the Jedi learning from their mistakes by helping someone with the darkest lineage are uplifting. I don't see any problem either with the idea that Rey was born from a dark lineage, raised as a nobody struggling to find her place and ends up choosing the family she identies with.  

For me, these ideas could have worked really well if DLF hadn't used their heroine as a mean to "whitewash" the Skywalker instead of "healing" that legacy properly. That story should have been about the Palpatine and the Skywalker heirs both struggling with the mistakes of the previous generations, atoning the bloody legacies of their ancestors and healing the wounds for a better future. That Rey was the one to destroy Palpatine makes sense:as his heir, she had to be the one to "repare" the bloody legacy of her lineage toward the Galaxy. My real issue is that DLF made her the sole bearer of the Skywalker legacy as if she was more worthy than the actual Skywalker heir to "repare" the bloody legacy of their family.

DLF seems to have forgotten that the reason why there is a ST to the Skywalker arc is because Anakin's fate repeated itself. The family tragedy wasn’t solved despite Vader's sacrifice partly because nobody aside from Luke got to witness his redemption  and the family connection was kept a secret, paving the way for Ben's fate because of how he was perceived by the others. As selfless as his sacrifice for his son was, it wasn't an act for the purpose of the greater good in mind: had Vader been confronted with the choice of saving Luke or the Galaxy, would have chosen the greater good ?  Vader’s redemption showed that a sacrifice alone couldn’t atone the dark legacy of the Skywalker family an heal the next generation since he was remembered only as the Dark Lord of the Sith.  And what does DLF give us as redemption for Ben ? Giving up his life for the sake of one person, no witness of his good action, kept a secret by said person...and erased from the ending without being honored contrary to all the other Skywalkers.

I could be okay with his death if he had experienced a moment where he would have been confronted with the dilemma of saving Rey from death or saving systems from destruction for all the Galaxy to witness. it could have been the right moment to have Anakin finally helping his grandson, thus avoiding that people complain he chose the Palpatine heir over his grandson, and contributing to atone their bloody legacy. But since it didn't happen I guess that making ben a Force Ghost is a good reparation instead of committing him to rebuild a new order and raise awareness about abuse. On top of that, DLF seems to think it's okay to have Rey carry on the Skywalker legacy alone because it's all about the good side of that legacy now and  "who cares for atonement since we ended the bloodline ?". In the end, the Skywalker legacy was healed so properly that J.J. and Terrio were more confortable with honoring the Holy  trio, as if the Skywalkers who have "sinned" shouldn't be remembered as part of this legacy. No wonder that people are left with the feeling that Skywalkers are a neglecting family and Rey a stealer although it wasn't the intention.
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Post by Acritiqua on Tue 28 Jan 2020, 11:21 am

TROS is a bit like a cat retreating to its litter box when it feels its entire territory has been overwhelmed by other animals and the smells of other animals. It can't forge out ahead, but retreats to its litter box to live in its own smells. TROS similarly retreats into a safe cozy nostalgia bubble, having given up an attempt to make new modern myths. But no one is happy living in a litter box, in stagnation, fear and despair, hanging onto old fantasies which can't sustain one through a new reality.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/24/opinion/star-wars-rise-of-skywalker.html
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Post by Darth Snoopy on Wed 29 Jan 2020, 9:37 am

@reylo1992 wrote:
@motherofpearl1 wrote:Same here. Grit my teeth and bear it.
But the whole thing was a tedious and ridiculous journey towards a completely unnecessary bad ending.

I've had to stop posting on CBR's SW forum,  there's so much love for this film, so much hate for Reylo and TLJ and I couldn't engage because you can get banned for answering back. People are entitled to like and hate, but it's so hard to see them insisting that the message of a Palpatine denying her heritage is a good one, and the Skywalkers will live on through Rey.

As a longtime fan, I will never cease to be amazed how many long time fans are accepting of this.  L/F and Disney wanted to 'begin anew'. So why keep the Palpatine bloodline going?

Hey guys - the bad guy won, but it's okay, his granddaughter stole the heroes' name so all's well and good.
@motherofpearl1

I am not as bitter as you are but there is definitely something not right with the ending of that movie. The worst part of it is that actually a lot of ideas have the potential to be meaningful and were intended to be. In itself, the idea of Rey rising above her dark legacy, Skywalkers correcting with the heir of their ennemy what they did wrong with their own heir and the Jedi learning from their mistakes by helping someone with the darkest lineage are uplifting. I don't see any problem either with the idea that Rey was born from a dark lineage, raised as a nobody struggling to find her place and ends up choosing the family she identies with.  

For me, these ideas could have worked really well if DLF hadn't used their heroine as a mean to "whitewash" the Skywalker instead of "healing" that legacy properly. That story should have been about the Palpatine and the Skywalker heirs both struggling with the mistakes of the previous generations, atoning the bloody legacies of their ancestors and healing the wounds for a better future. That Rey was the one to destroy Palpatine makes sense:as his heir, she had to be the one to "repare" the bloody legacy of her lineage toward the Galaxy. My real issue is that DLF made her the sole bearer of the Skywalker legacy as if she was more worthy than the actual Skywalker heir to "repare" the bloody legacy of their family.

DLF seems to have forgotten that the reason why there is a ST to the Skywalker arc is because Anakin's fate repeated itself. The family tragedy wasn’t solved despite Vader's sacrifice partly because nobody aside from Luke got to witness his redemption  and the family connection was kept a secret, paving the way for Ben's fate because of how he was perceived by the others. As selfless as his sacrifice for his son was, it wasn't an act for the purpose of the greater good in mind: had Vader been confronted with the choice of saving Luke or the Galaxy, would have chosen the greater good ?  Vader’s redemption showed that a sacrifice alone couldn’t atone the dark legacy of the Skywalker family an heal the next generation since he was remembered only as the Dark Lord of the Sith.  And what does DLF give us as redemption for Ben ? Giving up his life for the sake of one person, no witness of his good action, kept a secret by said person...and erased from the ending without being honored contrary to all the other Skywalkers.

I could be okay with his death if he had experienced a moment where he would have been confronted with the dilemma of saving Rey from death or saving systems from destruction for all the Galaxy to witness. it could have been the right moment to have Anakin finally helping his grandson, thus avoiding that people complain he chose the Palpatine heir over his grandson, and contributing to atone their bloody legacy. But since it didn't happen I guess that making ben a Force Ghost is a good reparation instead of committing him to rebuild a new order and raise awareness about abuse. On top of that, DLF seems to think it's okay to have Rey carry on the Skywalker legacy alone because it's all about the good side of that legacy now and  "who cares for atonement since we ended the bloodline ?". In the end, the Skywalker legacy was healed so properly that J.J. and Terrio were more confortable with honoring the Holy  trio, as if the Skywalkers who have "sinned" shouldn't be remembered as part of this legacy. No wonder that people are left with the feeling that Skywalkers are a neglecting family and Rey a stealer although it wasn't the intention.
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@reylo1992

The bolded is the result of a terribly handled story about found or acquired family in Reys arc. If they wanted Rey to really feel like she had found her place with the Skywalker, they shouldn't have killed them all. It also meant that Ben's story and how he related to being a part of this family with a legacy of heroism, sacrifice, villainy and atonement needed to be addressed more than it was. Rey may be the protagonist, but Ben was meant to also act as a comparison or parallel to HER - which effects how we view her story. Satisfying development and conclusion to both their arcs, as they obviously converge, was nescessary for a satisfying ending - in my opinion. I think it's why character arcs didn't '' land'', so to speak. They also dropped the ball with Finn, he lost all nuance when they wrote his character with only passing glances to his origin as a defected stormtrooper. I think they wanted new likable characters, but also couldn't place or design them to fit the narrative of the skywalker saga, to build of the old, but to actually move forward in the story in a logical and meaningful way.


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Post by motherofpearl1 on Thu 30 Jan 2020, 11:18 am

So....no Ben because"it's about the Skywalker legacy."
This after JJ and Pablo repeatedly insisting repeatedly that "Kylo is the Skywalker" post TFA.
Okay listen Terrio....
That's right. LISTEN.

Kylo Ren's mother was Leia Organa Solo. Who's name pre adoption was:
SKYWALKER.
Kylo is a SKYWALKER.
By blood and from birth.
Rey IS NOT.

My God they've actually forgotten they said it after the first film. Or have suddenly developed amnesia.

Meanwhile.....here in the UK TROS isn't showing at any of my local cinemas. TLJ was still showing in February. I know, because I saw it then!
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Post by vaderito on Thu 30 Jan 2020, 11:50 am

@motherofpearl1 wrote: S
Meanwhile.....here in the UK TROS isn't showing at any of my local cinemas. TLJ was still showing in February. I know, because I saw it then!
@motherofpearl1

the shade lol!
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Post by Dar-ren19 on Fri 31 Jan 2020, 4:45 pm

@motherofpearl1 wrote:So....no Ben because"it's about the Skywalker legacy."
This after JJ and Pablo repeatedly insisting repeatedly that "Kylo is the Skywalker" post TFA.
Okay listen Terrio....
That's right. LISTEN.

Kylo Ren's mother was Leia Organa Solo. Who's name pre adoption was:
SKYWALKER.
Kylo is a SKYWALKER.
By blood and from birth.
Rey IS NOT.

My God they've actually forgotten they said it after the first film. Or have suddenly developed amnesia.

Meanwhile.....here in the UK TROS isn't showing at any of my local cinemas. TLJ was still showing in February. I know, because I saw it then!
@motherofpearl1

I mean, Terrio and JJ said it IN THE FILM (TROS) -- As Palpatine is throwing Ben to the pit, he says: "As I fell, so must fall the Last Skywalker!"

So yeah I truly don't get it.
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Post by special_cases on Sat 08 Feb 2020, 7:31 am

I find it funny that TROS still has 86% on RottenTomatoes ( 4.3!!! when 5 is max), without even 1% change, with 97,159 votes, but on Letterboxd it has 2.9 aver. (out of 5) with 162165 votes, and on Metascore it has user score 4.9 out of 10. Scores by Metascore and Letterboxd are close to each other which makes it obvious that it's closer to the truth but somehow people on RottenTomatoes gave it 4.3 out of 5 score. Hmmmmm.
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Post by unicorn on Sat 08 Feb 2020, 11:12 am

somehow people on RottenTomatoes gave it 4.3 out of 5 score. Hmmmmm.

The force Rotten Tomatoes works in mysterious ways.
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Post by vaderito on Sat 08 Feb 2020, 11:41 am

Somehow, people on RT gave it 4.3 out of 5 score.

Somehow, Palpatine has returned.

Dark Side of the Force is a path to many abilities some consider unnatural.

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Post by motherofpearl1 on Sat 08 Feb 2020, 12:04 pm

Hey, what Jack Nicholson film was that one from?
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