Why Finn and Rey are an awesome duo, of friends!

@Force22 wrote:

AppleCrumble122 wrote:

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:Right, that makes sense. Film storytelling is definitely unique in execution, just like all mediums.

@FrolickingFizzgig

While we're on the subject though - can you think of any other films where the good guy type of hero didn't end up with the main girl? Nothing jumps out at me atm. Platonic friendships between a straight man and a straight woman so rare in movies, especially Hollywood ones.

@AppleCrumble122

I wrote about this in the beginning of the thread. Rey is the protagonist, and we rarely have female protagonists in cinema. You basically have to reverse her gender. Then Finn is her sidekick. It works in most hollywood movies. In most action/adventure movies the protagonist has at least one ally, that is not romantic.

The reason the girl always ends up with the guy is because there is usually only one girl, and she's there mainly to be the love interest. But Rey is not the love interest of the hero, she's the hero.

Women are rare in movies!

@Force22

Yep! There's always a group with a gang of guys and one girl. Leia with Luke and Han, Rey with Finn, Han, Chewbacca and Poe. Uhura with the rest of the enterprise crew, Hermione with Harry and Ron (even though Luna and Ginny join them somewhat), Katniss with Peeta and Gale and Felicity Jones with the rest of the Rogue One cast. Btw if Diego Luna isn't the LI of Felicity Jones then I'll eat my hat! I reckon that will be a reverse gender example.

You know what's even rarer? Friendships between women. We never see Hermione with Ginny and/or Luna (except in the background in Goblet of Fire), we only see Uhura help Carol Marcus in the background of Star Trek: Into Darkness, Katniss clashes with every other female in Hunger Games - although you could make an argument with Rue - and we never see Rey and Leia interact with any other female characters (not counting the scene at the end of TFA). I know they're not the main focus of the stories but it's still a serious issue. At least in the original EU there were great friendships between women such as Leia and her friendships with Mara and Winter. I know books and movies are different mediums but the comparisons are there and massively different. This is why I hope Rey and Kelly Marie Tran become friends later on in the trilogy.

@Force22 wrote:@AppleCrumble122
But really, I don't think these comparisons work. Finn is not the main guy, he's not even the hero. He's one of the heroes, but not the hero. There's no possible comparison! Finn and Rey make sense only if you imagine Finn as a protagonist, and it's not the case. Of course, many people think Finn is just as protagonist as Rey, if not the protagonist (guys will think that), and from that projection comes Finn and Rey because that's what you see in action movies. But it only works if Finn is the protagonist. He isn't!

@Force22

I disagree. I think the comparisons do work as a sort of strange role-reversal one because although Rey is indeed the main protagonist and heroine of the new trilogy, I'd say Finn is the main male hero. When I say that I mean the typical good guy type like Luke was in the OT . He's also clearly attracted to Rey and tries to rescue her both on Jakku and SKB (similar to how Luke rescued Leia) - and of course Rey wasn't interested and didn't need rescuing. There's also the fact that it's rumoured that Finn will be falling for KMT in episode VIII and Reylo will happen. So like Kirk with Uhura, (whose LI is Carol Marcus in Into Darkness) his relationship with Rey will have gone from a romantic attraction to a equal platonic one. My point is it'll still be a great example of a platonic friendship between a man and a woman in a Hollywood Blockbuster regardless of who's the main protagonist (it being a girl this time around).

@Rogue Rey wrote:
@AppleCrumble122

Mad Max: Fury Road. Max and Furiosa don't get it together at the end - he's the good guy, she's the main girl.

Not really the same but:

Aragon & Eowyn in The Lord of the Rings - he's the good guy, I guess she could be classed as the main girl (because they're thin on the ground in it) and she displays romantic interest in him, but they remain platonic.

Legolas & Tauriel in The Hobbit (I know she's a made up character + neither are in the book, but if you go with the film) - he's one of the main good guys, she's one of the main girls. He seems interested in her, but she's not interested in him so they remain platonic.

@Rogue Rey

Ooh I will definitely check out Mad Max, but personally I say it's debatable with Legolas and Tauriel because Tauriel doesn't get with either Thorin or Bilbo - arguably the main heroes, plus that particular love story was confusing and unnecessary in my opinion. Eowyn and Aragorn - that's really difficult! I'd definitely say you're right in the case of the books, but in the movies Arwen is given a much bigger role. I suppose it depends on your point of view in this case... or maybe both cases.

AppleCrumble122 wrote:

@Force22 wrote:@AppleCrumble122
But really, I don't think these comparisons work. Finn is not the main guy, he's not even the hero. He's one of the heroes, but not the hero. There's no possible comparison! Finn and Rey make sense only if you imagine Finn as a protagonist, and it's not the case. Of course, many people think Finn is just as protagonist as Rey, if not the protagonist (guys will think that), and from that projection comes Finn and Rey because that's what you see in action movies. But it only works if Finn is the protagonist. He isn't!

@Force22

I disagree. I think the comparisons do work as a sort of strange role-reversal one because although Rey is indeed the main protagonist and heroine of the new trilogy, I'd say Finn is the main male hero. When I say that I mean the typical good guy type like Luke was in the OT . He's also clearly attracted to Rey and tries to rescue her both on Jakku and SKB (similar to how Luke rescued Leia) - and of course Rey wasn't interested and didn't need rescuing. There's also the fact that it's rumoured that Finn will be falling for KMT in episode VIII and Reylo will happen. So like Kirk with Uhura, (whose LI is Carol Marcus in Into Darkness) his relationship with Rey will have gone from a romantic attraction to a equal platonic one. My point is it'll still be a great example of a platonic friendship between a man and a woman in a Hollywood Blockbuster regardless of who's the main protagonist (it being a girl this time around).

@Rogue Rey wrote:
@AppleCrumble122

Mad Max: Fury Road. Max and Furiosa don't get it together at the end - he's the good guy, she's the main girl.

Not really the same but:

Aragon & Eowyn in The Lord of the Rings - he's the good guy, I guess she could be classed as the main girl (because they're thin on the ground in it) and she displays romantic interest in him, but they remain platonic.

Legolas & Tauriel in The Hobbit (I know she's a made up character + neither are in the book, but if you go with the film) - he's one of the main good guys, she's one of the main girls. He seems interested in her, but she's not interested in him so they remain platonic.

@Rogue Rey

Ooh I will definitely check out Mad Max, but personally I say it's debatable with Legolas and Tauriel because Tauriel doesn't get with either Thorin or Bilbo - arguably the main heroes, plus that particular love story was confusing and unnecessary in my opinion. Eowyn and Aragorn - that's really difficult! I'd definitely say you're right in the case of the books, but in the movies Arwen is given a much bigger role. I suppose it depends on your point of view in this case... or maybe both cases.

@AppleCrumble122

I agree the whole Tauriel and Kili love story was unnecessary and distracting - don't know what possessed Peter Jackson with that one.

@Rogue Rey wrote:

AppleCrumble122 wrote:

@Force22 wrote:@AppleCrumble122
But really, I don't think these comparisons work. Finn is not the main guy, he's not even the hero. He's one of the heroes, but not the hero. There's no possible comparison! Finn and Rey make sense only if you imagine Finn as a protagonist, and it's not the case. Of course, many people think Finn is just as protagonist as Rey, if not the protagonist (guys will think that), and from that projection comes Finn and Rey because that's what you see in action movies. But it only works if Finn is the protagonist. He isn't!

@Force22

I disagree. I think the comparisons do work as a sort of strange role-reversal one because although Rey is indeed the main protagonist and heroine of the new trilogy, I'd say Finn is the main male hero. When I say that I mean the typical good guy type like Luke was in the OT . He's also clearly attracted to Rey and tries to rescue her both on Jakku and SKB (similar to how Luke rescued Leia) - and of course Rey wasn't interested and didn't need rescuing. There's also the fact that it's rumoured that Finn will be falling for KMT in episode VIII and Reylo will happen. So like Kirk with Uhura, (whose LI is Carol Marcus in Into Darkness) his relationship with Rey will have gone from a romantic attraction to a equal platonic one. My point is it'll still be a great example of a platonic friendship between a man and a woman in a Hollywood Blockbuster regardless of who's the main protagonist (it being a girl this time around).

@Rogue Rey wrote:
@AppleCrumble122

Mad Max: Fury Road. Max and Furiosa don't get it together at the end - he's the good guy, she's the main girl.

Not really the same but:

Aragon & Eowyn in The Lord of the Rings - he's the good guy, I guess she could be classed as the main girl (because they're thin on the ground in it) and she displays romantic interest in him, but they remain platonic.

Legolas & Tauriel in The Hobbit (I know she's a made up character + neither are in the book, but if you go with the film) - he's one of the main good guys, she's one of the main girls. He seems interested in her, but she's not interested in him so they remain platonic.

@Rogue Rey

Ooh I will definitely check out Mad Max, but personally I say it's debatable with Legolas and Tauriel because Tauriel doesn't get with either Thorin or Bilbo - arguably the main heroes, plus that particular love story was confusing and unnecessary in my opinion. Eowyn and Aragorn - that's really difficult! I'd definitely say you're right in the case of the books, but in the movies Arwen is given a much bigger role. I suppose it depends on your point of view in this case... or maybe both cases.

@AppleCrumble122

I agree the whole Tauriel and Kili love story was unnecessary and distracting - don't know what possessed Peter Jackson with that one.

@Rogue Rey
The need for filler.

AppleCrumble122 wrote:

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:Right, that makes sense. Film storytelling is definitely unique in execution, just like all mediums.

@FrolickingFizzgig

While we're on the subject though - can you think of any other films where the good guy type of hero didn't end up with the main girl? Nothing jumps out at me atm. Platonic friendships between a straight man and a straight woman so rare in movies, especially Hollywood ones.

@AppleCrumble122
Off the top of my head, iRobot comes to mind. There's a little bit of light flirtation between Detective Spooner and the doctor, but nothing hugely substantial.

xDD.

@Rimfaxe96 wrote:



xDD.

@Rimfaxe96
Pure gold.

@Rimfaxe96 haha, yea Finn is loopdy loop

AppleCrumble122 wrote:

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
They're probably hoping she'll be an alien or something (even though her stunt-double was clearly human and wearing some kind of Resistance uniform). But she's so flipping cute. She's perfect for him.

I think she's going to be his love-interest too. There have been rumours since autumn that Boyega was doing chemistry readings, and Tran was ultimately cast. He was always getting a real love-interest (which is why he was so quick to shut down Stormpilot after The Force Awakens came out). He knew where his character was going.

I don't buy that her role was cut down either. I still think the edits had to do with incorporating more Finn and Poe scenes, or perhaps just more Poe scenes. I said this in the Evil Empire, but the sheer fact that they ride a horse together tells me that they're going to get to know each other. I really do think his relationship with her is going to be used to isolate Rey.

@FrolickingFizzgig

Isolate Rey? In what way? Do you reckon they could use it in order for her to feel lonely and maybe more open to Kylo Ren's manipulations to try to get her on his side? Or could they just be using it so Finn and Rey don't cross paths in this movie?

@AppleCrumble122
Well the idea is that Finn is going to wake up surrounded by members of the Resistance. He'll be immediately regarded as a hero and as the man who saved Poe. He'll make new friends and find himself with attachments quickly just because of the circumstances. He'll find the destiny that was always meant for him in the Resistance, even if it takes a little time for them to trust him.

Meanwhile, Rey is all but definitely going to be rejected at first by Luke. He looks sad and furious at the end of The Force Awakens, and I highly doubt he'll be returning just because some girl handed him a lightsaber. She's going to be all alone again despite everything she overcame in The Force Awakens, and while Luke is of course going to warm up to her eventually, I suspect they'll be spending a while together. But he'll be her mentor, not her friend, and imagine how strange it would be for her to return and find Finn fitting in perfectly with the Resistance. Force Sensitivity is in itself isolating.

I don't think Kylo is going to try to manipulate her. I really don't. It just wouldn't make sense. The guy was very open with her right from the moment they met. He made himself vulnerable for her in the interrogation when he removed his mask, he wasted the entire snow fight chasing her and attempting to disarm her, and then he expressed that he wanted to be her teacher. Kylo is a terrible liar. He was being genuine, offering something to someone else, a rare occurrence for someone groomed to be so entitled.

I think Rey might think he's trying to manipulate her.

@FrolickingFizzgig

Interesting! I can definitely see Finn's story starting out that way. Hasn't it been rumoured that Luke will in be space Las Vegas? Rey thinking Kylo Ren manipulating her is kind of what I meant, but I don't know - yes he's honest with her, but from his point of view he probably wouldn't think he was manipulating her onto his side. Anyway it's pure speculation on my part - your theory works a lot better. Ugh... is it December 2017 yet?

It is interesting that a lot of Rey and Finn's scenes had to be reshot http://io9.gizmodo.com/harrison-fords-on-set-injury-rescued-the-force-awakens-1771899668?utm_campaign=socialflow_io9_twitter&utm_source=io9_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

@BastilaBey wrote:

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:Not sure about "the most important relationship in the film" bit, but interesting that a lot of their scenes were reshot http://io9.gizmodo.com/harrison-fords-on-set-injury-rescued-the-force-awakens-1771899668?utm_campaign=socialflow_io9_twitter&utm_source=io9_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

@Mrs Ben Solo
For being too "contentious" LOL

Finn and Rey probably is the most important relationship in The Force Awakens. That has the capacity to change now that the two don't seem to be spending much time together in Episode VIII (unsurprisingly).

@FrolickingFizzgig

Contentious is interesting...heard that they put a lot of Daisy and John's natural friendship into the characters' dynamic so maybe that's when it happened? If it had stayed contentious they might have actually ended up being more likely love interests...as it stands, there's no tension there at all. Rey does still like to snap at him a little, though!

@BastilaBey
That could very well have been the problem. The emphasis on Rey and Finn's tension definitely would have made them come across as romantic interests. Perhaps upon editing JJ realized that it wasn't working and decided to reshoot on the basis that they had to ensure that there was no romantic tension between the two at all. I would say it worked, and it's interesting to know that they may have went to extra effort to achieve the dynamic they wanted. The one they gave us was undoubtedly what they were going for: friends/family.

I thought the scene where Rey and Finn are congratulating each other on the MF was very forced and awkward.

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:It is interesting that a lot of Rey and Finn's scenes had to be reshot http://io9.gizmodo.com/harrison-fords-on-set-injury-rescued-the-force-awakens-1771899668?utm_campaign=socialflow_io9_twitter&utm_source=io9_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

@Mrs Ben Solo

'Contentious' LOL

that could mean only one thing..JJ reshot Rey Finn scenes to eliminate romantic tension from their relationship....

@Mana wrote:

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:It is interesting that a lot of Rey and Finn's scenes had to be reshot http://io9.gizmodo.com/harrison-fords-on-set-injury-rescued-the-force-awakens-1771899668?utm_campaign=socialflow_io9_twitter&utm_source=io9_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

@Mrs Ben Solo

'Contentious' LOL

that could mean only one thing..JJ reshot Rey Finn scenes to eliminate romantic tension from their relationship....

@Mana

I agree.

In the final movie, the relationship between the two is respectful, friendly and fun.

Um, that sounds awesome. What it doesn't sound like is sexy/romantic or ship worthy in the least, and it appears that was the intention. A contentious relationship between two people who are largely on the same side and are supposed to get along sounds interesting, exciting, intriguing, full of spice. Like Hanleia. Or Kylo and Rey if Kylo defects from the FO. ^.^

I am really glad that they're trying to make clear that Finn and Rey are meant to be great friends. I know some people like the idea of a love triangle but I actually cannot stand that trope. I want a romance that is more like Star Wars, less like Twilight. The last thing we need is Team Kylo and Team Finn (which, notice, hasn't happened.) So glad there isn't a triangle in sight so far, unless you count Vader's mask.

I agree with others here. Whatever JJ did with Rey and Finn's dynamic, he removed all tension, or build up. There must have been a reason for that, just like there was a reason he had Kylo act the way he did toward Rey. If JJ wanted there to be a future romance between Rey and Finn, he should have kept a little of the contention between them rather than allowing Daisy and John's natural best buds/tag team chemistry to define the dynamic. The end result is a easy friendship that feels like they are set up to be each others' family, like Luke and Leia. Their friendship is cute and sweet, but nothing compelling.

I honestly do not see what the Finnreys perceive in their dynamic that makes them think it will lead to a possible romance. If Rey and Finn go romantic after what we saw in TFA, it will look awkward based on the dynamic set up in TFA.

I think it's interesting how pre TFA they had DR and JB promote the move together and to some it looked like because they were setting them up to be the next big couple.However post TFA we have them saying Rey and Finn are great friends without hinting of the possibility of romance.
It's also interesting that prior to the Millennium Falcon scenes it's like they were trying to create some sort of tension between them with the aggressive way Rey went after Finn in their first meeting,Finn holding her hand and Rey not liking it and them snapping at each other while they were on the run from the Stormtroopers however all that so called tension disappeared when they got aboard  the Falcon and met Han.

@CienaRee wrote:I think it's interesting how pre TFA they had DR and JB promote the move together and to some it looked like because they were setting them up to be the next big couple.However post TFA we have them saying Rey and Finn are great friends without hinting of the possibility of romance.
It's also interesting that prior to the Millennium Falcon scenes it's like they were trying to create some sort of tension between them with the aggressive way Rey went after Finn in their first meeting,Finn holding her hand and Rey not liking it and them snapping at each other while they were on the run from the Stormtroopers however all that so called tension disappeared when they got aboard  the Falcon and met Han.

@CienaRee

Whenever Rey and Finn were getting emotional as in sorta lovey dovey, it was interrupted almost all the time. It is interesting that the first lovey dovey scene between them is interrupted by Kylo.

And thank goodness cause those scenes were insufferable. They are young but not THAT young for kiddie crap that was served in their scenes. Talking at the same time, are you kidding me? File under annoying.

Tells me about it.Every time they tried to make Finn sound like Han it looked forced as Hell to me.
But to be honest I think it would have made more sense character and time wise if Finn and Rey had the mind of friendship Han and Luke had in ANH.I mean these people meet and become family in the span of only one day ?In Rey's case especially given how distrustful she seemed to be of other people I think would have taken a while for her to warm up to Finn.

I always interpreted their relationship as Brother-Sister/BFFs, right down to how she's been "waiting for her family" to come for her on Jakku. It's Finn who shows up and prompts her to leave with him. Regardless of how the mystery of who her parents were shakes out, what counts is that he's her family now (and I'd guess a big conflict if you know who starts to put the moves on her).

Also yes to the above about the marketing playing up the actors' bond/friendship. Which is genuine and very endearing, but also definitely filial/friends and maybe a bit of a distraction from who they're setting up for the eventual romance.

I loved all the scenes between Rey and Finn...I watched them many times and never have I saw any chemistry...their interactions couldn't be more familial even if they were brother and sister...one of the scenes I like the most is whit the Rathars...when Rey saves him....he is that clueless to understand that she did it and she doesn't really care if he knows it or not...if you love someone you would kinda want them to think best of you....
"It had me!!! But the DOOR!"
"That was lucky"
I laugh every time to this exchange

Arcana wrote:I loved all the scenes between Rey and Finn...I watched them many times and never have I saw any chemistry...their interactions couldn't be more familial even if they were brother and sister...one of the scenes I like the most is whit the Rathars...when Rey saves him....he is that clueless to understand that she did it and she doesn't really care if he knows it or not...if you love someone you would kinda want them to think best of you....
"It had me!!! But the DOOR!"
"That was lucky"
I laugh every time to this exchange

@Arcana

Yea.....plus there is the scene were Finn is confessing that he lied to Rey and all Rey has to say in the end is "don't go". I feel if she felt anything more than just friendship for Finn she would have said more or commented on what he said but she didn't. That scene always reminds me of someone confessing love or whatever and the other person is oblivious because they just don't feel the same way at all. They aren't even physically attracted to them so their response is nothing of interest.

But they share a force bond, can't you see???!!! *sarcastic moment of the evening*

From The Stormtrooper and the Scavenger:

Daisy: "We're just like brother and sister. (John nods) That's really the best I can describe it. We get on really well. We're both incredibly silly."

John: "What fans see in the movie in terms of our rhythm, in terms of our banter is actually real offscreen. When J.J. was going through the script he made some tweaks based on the way [Daisy and I] talk to each other."

Daisy: "It's just, it's easy. It's not hard to find that relationship with someone you get on so well with."

I can see why the FinnRey's have quieted down so much. This coupled with the "Rey and Finn are BFF's comment" probably hit them hard.