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The Last Jedi General Discussion

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Post by 12 Parsnips on Fri 13 Sep 2019, 2:50 pm

@motherofpearl1 wrote:I've just read an article in which a journalist described several points which proved Rian wasn't completely altering in TLJ what JJ began in TFA. He mentioned that Luke's reaction to seeing Rey at the end heralded his behaviour towards her and the dark secret which explained his choosing to exile himself, as well as it was 'obvious' Rey's parents weren't going to be very important as Maz herself stressed that the belonging she sought  lay ahead not behind her.
But when he claimed Rey's belonging was represented by the Resistance, which were now her family, I think he was mistaken. I'll never forget the sad look on her face as she watched Finn tending Rose. She very obviously envied what they had found in each other.

Even among friends Rey seemed isolated. Because let's face it, none of the Resistance are Force sensitive except Leia. And with Leia gone, Rey has no one to understand. Except the man who's on the opposite side. In her way she's as lonely as Ben Solo.
@motherofpearl1

I've found that a lot of males think that Rey has everything she needs in the Resistance at the end of TLJ. Maybe it takes seeing with the female gaze to recognize (and empathize with?) her loneliness and isolation? I don't know--the look on her face seemed to communicate her isolation so clearly to me that I can't understand how people miss it.
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Post by Gemini on Fri 13 Sep 2019, 3:04 pm

@KiraRen2015 wrote:@Gemini Have you seen the description of it on the Mondo website? They even use the words "infamous thigh grab" in it!
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He grabs her thigh?
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Post by KiraRen2015 on Fri 13 Sep 2019, 3:08 pm

@Gemini Lol no. The "thigh grab" has been the term for that scene (mostly by Reylos) because when she jumps on his back to kick the guard, she grabs his leg. It's just nice to see that referenced by an article I guess.

The painting itself is beautiful! Too bad it's only available at Texas Comic Con. I hope there'll be some available online afterwards.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Fri 13 Sep 2019, 3:13 pm

I really like Kylo Ren with his hair all over his face!
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Post by Gemini on Fri 13 Sep 2019, 4:30 pm

@KiraRen2015 wrote:@Gemini Lol no. The "thigh grab" has been the term for that scene (mostly by Reylos) because when she jumps on his back to kick the guard, she grabs his leg. It's just nice to see that referenced by an article I guess.

The painting itself is beautiful! Too bad it's only available at Texas Comic Con. I hope there'll be some available online afterwards.
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Lol, I never saw that! I'll look out for it.
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Post by snufkin on Sun 22 Sep 2019, 1:13 pm

I don't know who here has seen the classic late 80s romantic comedy-drama, Moonstruck, but it was on TV the other day and I realized that it's another set of movie references which got dropped into TLJ



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I wouldn't be inclined to think that this was just a coincidence if not for the # of times Rian has tweeted about being an opera fan, including going to the Metropolitan Opera House in New York (the location where Moonstruck's illicit lovers on the opposite side of a family estrangement go on their hand holding assignation) this past Spring to watch the Ring Cycle. Also his Rolling Stone interview talked about the actual operatic elements of the Saga. Also fun fact - both the original Star Wars and Moonstruck were championed/brought to production by Alan Ladd, Jr.
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Post by MrsWindu on Fri 27 Sep 2019, 3:16 pm

@snufkin OOH wow good catch - I haven't seen Moonstruck in years
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Post by snufkin on Fri 27 Sep 2019, 6:26 pm

@MrsWindu I couldn't find any interviews/social media posts from Rian where he mentions it specifically. But as a self professed musicals nerd, he's a huge fan of the director, Norman Jewison, who did Fiddler on the Roof. But it's a little too on the nose with how some of the shots are similar, especially when he did say in the press for TLJ that one of the elements of the Saga he wanted to get across was the 'operatics' of it all.
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Post by Teo oswald on Sun 29 Sep 2019, 7:49 am

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Post by motherofpearl1 on Thu 03 Oct 2019, 2:31 am

I can't help but think re watching TLJ that if Kylo is a cynic, Rey is the naive one.
She wanted Ben to leave the FO.....but what would have become of him if he had? I doubt if even Leia would have welcomed him with open arms.

If the leaks from TROS are correct and Hux is captured by the Resistance I wonder if seeing the way they treat him will make Rey realise Kylo couldn't have returned with her.
Just a thought.
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Post by rey09 on Fri 18 Oct 2019, 10:34 pm

I randomly came across this on youtube, saw Atonement once years ago when I was way younger. I saw his fists and totally thought of Kylo XD. Also similar thinking process with the water. Ah the sexual frustration...


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Post by MrsWindu on Sun 27 Oct 2019, 3:04 pm

I must have watched this scene dozens of times but WoW I’ve never noticed before that Rey is the one take her hand away first when Luke appears. Kylo’s is still suspended there for much longer, it makes me catch my breath. Thank you to @gwendy85 for her recent slo mo gifs

https://gwendy85.tumblr.com/post/188623415998
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Post by SheLitAFire on Tue 03 Dec 2019, 9:47 am

Daisy analyzes the Throne Room scene (NEW, posted several hours ago)

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Post by rey09 on Tue 03 Dec 2019, 8:43 pm

@SheLitAFire wrote:Daisy analyzes the Throne Room scene (NEW, posted several hours ago)

@SheLitAFire

I totally missed the first time until I saw the quote because her voice gets so low, but omg I'd love to see the part where he was carrying her around after finishing that take. That's also for ppl who think Daisy and Adam aren't tight enough lol.

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Post by MrsWindu on Mon 23 Dec 2019, 2:39 pm

I have no idea where this image surfaced from ( I saw on Twitter) but by heck Adam has very nice arms

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Post by MrsWindu on Tue 24 Dec 2019, 1:00 pm

I’m sure many of us have wondered what Rian Johnson’s thoughts are on the Rise of Skywalker and we can read into the tweet featuring just Kelly Marie. This latest one had a response from Ava DuVernay. I know she has a close relationship with JJ and recommended Victoria Mahoney. Why would she say ‘...a teacher to me at this moment...’ ? Who knows, it’s just a relief to see this for Rian

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https://twitter.com/ava/status/1209509245206401024?s=21
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Post by snufkin on Tue 24 Dec 2019, 9:47 pm

@MrsWindu It's very gracious of her but it's also hard to figure out where it's coming from because she's been a huge booster for this film when by all accounts, it's both not very well thought out/put together and also a rather pointed dig at Rian Johnson's film. Plus she and Victoria Mahoney were low key snarking on Marriage Story on Twitter which say what you will about it being mediocre or Noah Baumbach's hubris but at least he put together a coherent story and made more effective use of the two movies' mutual lead actor. Mostly I gave TRoS a big benefit of the doubt because of her involvement with TFA and in general being somebody with a rep as a stellar filmmaker and advocate for film history as a host for Turner Classic Movies. But seeing this play out has actually taken her down a notch in my estimation because is this some kind of sincere olive branch on her part? Especially when she threw her weight behind TRoS and we all know how it treated KMT.
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Post by SanghaRen on Wed 25 Dec 2019, 2:16 am

I must be too sarcastic, but I don’t see RJ’s tweet as positive towards TRoS. He’s thanking the SW fans, not LF, for defying every cynical narrative. And you can smell the business cynicism in TRoS. Maybe I am projecting my own thoughts onto his tweet. He’s at least being showered by appreciation from fans.

It’s always weird to see people in the industry interacting with each other on social media. Especially when you can feel that there are issues at hand. You’re the witness of only a tiny part of the story.
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Post by MaddieDove on Wed 25 Dec 2019, 5:03 am

@SanghaRen, you are right, to me it's obvious that RJ doesn't appreciate TRoS, he's not blind. If us the viewers saw the shameless retconning of TLJ and in places really mean and petty jabs at his choices (clearly visible in Mark Hamill's acting, for example, when Luke's talking about treating lightsaber with more respect), do you think the author who knows his work intimately wouldn't see it too right away? He knows. And he knows the studio is behind that, they made the choice against artistic integrity, for the mindless, crowd-pleasing shallow spectacle. That's the cynical narrative he's talking about. Here he's grateful to the outpour of solidarity of his fans and their appreciation of what he's done for franchise, in contrast to the studio who threw him under the bus.

As for Ava, my first interpretation is that she's also aware of everything that happens, and her friendship with and support to JJ notwithstanding, she admires Rian being graceful about it. Yes, she can learn from him in this moment.
I don't think she's stellar filmmaker, her A Wrinkle in Time is awfully bad film on par with TRoS, but that doesn't mean she can't appreciate Rian Johnson as a filmmaker.
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Post by MrsWindu on Wed 25 Dec 2019, 5:51 pm

@snufkin

As I’ve not been back on Twitter until recently I didn’t I know about the snark. It’s still so early to say how those involved are handling the reception of TROS . I wonder with a few more months or years hindsight how it will eventually play out.

@SanghaRen @MaddieDove
I agree we only see a tiny fraction of how these films are made and the Dynamics are with all the various writers and directors.We are left to interpret it the best way we can and sometimes the tone may be lost in translation or veiled as something else.
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Post by nickandnora on Wed 25 Dec 2019, 6:37 pm

RJ has said absolutely nothing about TRoS, not a word other than that tweet about Kelly and the response to the #thankyou tag (in which he was very gracious but careful about his wording). For a man who has ALWAYS commented positively on Star Wars - I remember he was very enthusiastic about the trailer for instance - this is not like him, and very VERY telling.

It's possible he hasn't gotten around to seeing it yet, but as far as I understand it, his wife has been REALLY into liking critical tweets about it.

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Post by snufkin on Sun 29 Dec 2019, 7:26 pm

Ava just posted something else in support of Knives Out box office as "a victory over the mean and petty" so that's shaping up to be the Mystery Box around TRoS. If the movie deliberately kneecapped Rian's plot/character development and he wasn't allowed to return to do the movie, who are the mean and petty she's referring to?
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Post by rey09 on Sun 29 Dec 2019, 7:48 pm

@snufkin wrote:Ava just posted something else in support of Knives Out box office as "a victory over the mean and petty" so that's shaping up to be the Mystery Box around TRoS. If the movie deliberately kneecapped Rian's plot/character development and he wasn't allowed to return to do the movie, who are the mean and petty she's referring to?
@snufkin

I thought she was referring to ppl who were saying TROS was better than TLJ/ ppl saying JJ had no choice to do TROS as is because of Rian's choices in TLJ.

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Post by MaddieDove on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 2:11 am

@MaddieDove wrote:@SanghaRen, you are right, to me it's obvious that RJ doesn't appreciate TRoS, he's not blind. If us the viewers saw the shameless retconning of TLJ and in places really mean and petty jabs at his choices (clearly visible in Mark Hamill's acting, for example, when Luke's talking about treating lightsaber with more respect), do you think the author who knows his work intimately wouldn't see it too right away? He knows. And he knows the studio is behind that, they made the choice against artistic integrity, for the mindless, crowd-pleasing shallow spectacle. That's the cynical narrative he's talking about. Here he's grateful to the outpour of solidarity of his fans and their appreciation of what he's done for franchise, in contrast to the studio who threw him under the bus.

As for Ava, my first interpretation is that she's also aware of everything that happens, and her friendship with and support to JJ notwithstanding, she admires Rian being graceful about it. Yes, she can learn from him in this moment.
I don't think she's stellar filmmaker, her A Wrinkle in Time is awfully bad film on par with TRoS, but that doesn't mean she can't appreciate Rian Johnson as a filmmaker.
@MaddieDove
lol
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Post by snufkin on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 3:40 am

@rey09 Likely she was. However it's still very odd when she's very much affiliated with this production and especially JJ with how hard TRoS apparently goes to rebuke and undo everything Rian did in TLJ.
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