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Post by MaddieDove on Tue 05 Jan 2021, 8:02 pm

They decided to kill the character, after stabbing him firstly by the hand of a supposed force diad partner of his, decided to kill down any meaningful love story, including putting a careful additional effort in the novelization, decided not to give him any lines during his supposed redemption, no force ghost apparition for him, no mourning by other characters, nothing, NOTHING.

Why would I trust them now to give us "some justice"?? It's over now, they put so much effort in making it so sure during 2019 for it to be over.
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Post by karamelreylo on Tue 05 Jan 2021, 9:00 pm

I'm with y'all who don't trust them. The only Star Wars people I trust are the Reylo fanfic writers, and well, Claudia Gray.

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Post by motherofpearl1 on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 1:41 am

@MaddieDove wrote:They decided to kill the character, after stabbing him firstly by the hand of a supposed force diad partner of his, decided to kill down any meaningful love story, including putting a careful additional effort in the novelization, decided not to give him any lines during his supposed redemption, no force ghost apparition for him, no mourning by other characters, nothing, NOTHING.

Why would I trust them now to give us "some justice"?? It's over now, they put so much effort in making it so sure during 2019 for it to be over.
@MaddieDove

This.
If there are two - or three - things that sealed Ben's fate for me it's the quotes from the novel.
"A kiss of gratitude"
"Given Rey back to the galaxy"
"She would have liked to know Ben Solo, but she could never love Kylo Ren"

This book was written after TROS, and I'm pretty sure DLF had an influence on it, including choosing an author who wasn't a reylo fan. Ultimately the book hammered home the fact that the ST was all about Rey, Rey, Rey, not Ben Solo, despite - or because of - him being the last real Skywalker. His fate was to die saving Rey, Rey, Rey - that's his entire purpose. He died gifting the galaxy....Palpatine's granddaughter. After TROS you can watch the ST again and gradually realise that Rey was never meant to be Ben's lover, but his replacement.

It seems a damaged, broken young man was not a good enough heir for Terrio's version of the Twins. No, they must have a virginal image of perfection. Ben was an abuse victim. Rey is perfect. The golden child, the true heir, adored by those who meet her, and whose fates are to trail after her like groupies or die saving her. And the latter is so significant next to Rey, Rey, REY!!!!!! - that post feeding the space vampire his life force, he disappears. Not a mention, not a FG.....nothing.
The SW saga ends with the Twins' FGs staring proudly at their 'true' heir, the last Palpatine. Who essentially killed the last Skywalker. What a delightfully hopeful, satisfying., 'fun' ending.
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Post by karamelreylo on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 6:30 am

@motherofpearl1 wrote:
@MaddieDove wrote:They decided to kill the character, after stabbing him firstly by the hand of a supposed force diad partner of his, decided to kill down any meaningful love story, including putting a careful additional effort in the novelization, decided not to give him any lines during his supposed redemption, no force ghost apparition for him, no mourning by other characters, nothing, NOTHING.

Why would I trust them now to give us "some justice"?? It's over now, they put so much effort in making it so sure during 2019 for it to be over.
@MaddieDove

This.
If there are two - or three - things that sealed Ben's fate for me it's the quotes from the novel.
"A kiss of gratitude"
"Given Rey back to the galaxy"
"She would have liked to know Ben Solo, but she could never love Kylo Ren"

This book was written after TROS, and I'm pretty sure DLF had an influence on it, including choosing an author who wasn't a reylo fan. Ultimately the book hammered home the fact that the ST was all about Rey, Rey, Rey, not Ben Solo, despite - or because of - him being the last real Skywalker. His fate was to die saving Rey, Rey, Rey - that's his entire purpose. He died gifting the galaxy....Palpatine's granddaughter. After TROS you can watch the ST again and gradually realise that Rey was never meant to be Ben's lover, but his replacement.

It seems a damaged, broken young man was not a good enough heir for Terrio's version of the Twins. No, they must have a virginal image of perfection. Ben was an abuse victim. Rey is perfect. The golden child, the true heir, adored by those who meet her, and whose fates are to trail after her like groupies or die saving her. And the latter is so significant next to Rey, Rey, REY!!!!!! - that post feeding the space vampire his life force, he disappears. Not a mention, not a FG.....nothing.
The SW saga ends with the Twins' FGs staring proudly at their 'true' heir, the last Palpatine. Who essentially killed the last Skywalker. What a delightfully hopeful, satisfying., 'fun' ending.
@motherofpearl1

You know, I'm still not sure why Rae Carson doesn't like Reylo. It's not like she doesn't write romance into her fantasies.

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Post by AhsokaTano on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 8:18 am

An author’s opinion is just that - an opinion and their interpretation. Doesn’t mean it’s right ( remember another Star Wars author who wrote the padme novels who is also anti reylo?).They are given enough info only for the book from the storygroup but not the entire picture and obviously they bring in their likes and dislikes etc to what they write . We haven’t had Ben solo’s full story yet . We don’t know what they have planned for him but they do have something. I know this is a reylo forum but even reylo means different things to different people here too. I just want Ben back and for his character to get some justice as I don’t think his journey is complete( even if Rey’s is). With or without Rey to be honest but there is the dyad so I doubt that bond can even be broken especially if they are taking myth and religion into account. JJ Abrams told Daisy Star Wars was religion , the hero’s journey by Joseph Campbell is the original story of the soul’s journey .Star wars has many interpretations but it definitely takes from religion and myths like the hero with a thousand faces , the lord of hosts in the Bible ( masked messiah of Isaiah ) who renames his beloved bride with a new name (Skywalker ?)and is with her forever, Loki loptr ( skywalker) in Norse mythology with his wife , lord shiva who split his soul into two so he could have a wife , Adam and Eve , the force itself which has dual aspect embodied in Rey and kylo . Rian Johnson even told us Rey and kylo were two halves of our protagonist which to me are the force itself ( or God for want of another name or the soul depending how you look at it ). Even the way Star Wars is split into canon and non canon is like religion.

Maybe the mistake I and others made was thinking Star Wars followed the rules of physics like we have on earth and it was like our world but of course it doesn’t and it isn’t because for a start we have space wizards who can turn themselves into force ghosts and it’s a far more spiritual world literally ( force ghosts ) and metaphorically ( the force as religion is fundamental in their life ).Moreover the name skywalker already tells us this is someone who walks in the heavens , sky, space ( like Loki who is a spirit that can change form and he takes the name skywalker
Too ).

Luke warned us in the last Jedi that things were not going to go the way we thought they were going to go . It’s something I’ve thought about a lot this past year especially as have had time to process more because of the pandemic etc .
Am just going to see where Star Wars goes but definitely won’t presume anymore that Star Wars is like our world here . That point changed for me when Rey looked in the mirror cave in last Jedi and the Rey looking back at the end of this sequence was a mirror image /a reflection. To me Star Wars is a mirror world to ours ( netherworld) and things work in reverse . So whereas for instance in myths and religion we start with an Adam and Eve character, in Star Wars you end with the Adam and Eve character with the snake ( Palpatine) and the tree. It’s like everything works in reverse . Just one of many interpretations and how I’ve tried to reconcile this in my head . I love you
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 9:21 am

@karamelreylo wrote:
@motherofpearl1 wrote:
@MaddieDove wrote:They decided to kill the character, after stabbing him firstly by the hand of a supposed force diad partner of his, decided to kill down any meaningful love story, including putting a careful additional effort in the novelization, decided not to give him any lines during his supposed redemption, no force ghost apparition for him, no mourning by other characters, nothing, NOTHING.

Why would I trust them now to give us "some justice"?? It's over now, they put so much effort in making it so sure during 2019 for it to be over.
@MaddieDove

This.
If there are two - or three - things that sealed Ben's fate for me it's the quotes from the novel.
"A kiss of gratitude"
"Given Rey back to the galaxy"
"She would have liked to know Ben Solo, but she could never love Kylo Ren"

This book was written after TROS, and I'm pretty sure DLF had an influence on it, including choosing an author who wasn't a reylo fan. Ultimately the book hammered home the fact that the ST was all about Rey, Rey, Rey, not Ben Solo, despite - or because of - him being the last real Skywalker. His fate was to die saving Rey, Rey, Rey - that's his entire purpose. He died gifting the galaxy....Palpatine's granddaughter. After TROS you can watch the ST again and gradually realise that Rey was never meant to be Ben's lover, but his replacement.

It seems a damaged, broken young man was not a good enough heir for Terrio's version of the Twins. No, they must have a virginal image of perfection. Ben was an abuse victim. Rey is perfect. The golden child, the true heir, adored by those who meet her, and whose fates are to trail after her like groupies or die saving her. And the latter is so significant next to Rey, Rey, REY!!!!!! - that post feeding the space vampire his life force, he disappears. Not a mention, not a FG.....nothing.
The SW saga ends with the Twins' FGs staring proudly at their 'true' heir, the last Palpatine. Who essentially killed the last Skywalker. What a delightfully hopeful, satisfying., 'fun' ending.
@motherofpearl1

You know, I'm still not sure why Rae Carson doesn't like Reylo. It's not like she doesn't write romance into her fantasies.
@karamelreylo

I did read somewhere that she is a Finn fan, whether she is a Finn/Rey fan remains to be seen. But after the Lego holiday special I am quite convinced that we will start to see Finn/Rey comics, they never showed anything romantic between Finn and Jannah and JJ made sure Finn/Rose is water under the bridge.
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Post by californiagirl on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 11:59 am

I got the sense the author was into Reylo? She was also announced before they had finished reshoots, I doubt she knew much going in. I do feel like the powers above did require her to do certain things as damage control, I recall the novel was delayed.

I don't put much stock in the Den of Nerds people, they're clickbaity Youtubers, just not as toxic as some other groups. Nor do I think having an online debate with an alt-right group like Fandom Menace is a good idea that will accomplish anything.

I still don't see Rey as intentionally taking Ben's life force. Pretty sure she was dead or at least extremely unconscious. Realistically d-lookingead Rey also disturbed people too, which doesn't get brought up as much since she ended up fine at the end. Despite her ample screen time, she was weirdly passive in much of the film, more things happen to her than she makes happen. Just sucks that Ben having agency in that scene meant he died.

TROS, and even Disney now, not only don't get why people like Reylo, but Ben/Kylo, or Rey, or the ST, or honestly the OT. It's really tragic, they just saw interest and money with no idea why. Hard to fathom them being that clueless.
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Post by Saracene on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 1:42 pm

The notion that Rey “killed” Ben in the end is preposterous when giving up his life force was obviously 100% his own choice.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 2:17 pm

Yes, but.....he did it out of love for Rey, but also because he believed that was all he was worth. That he amounted to nothing, and therefore he could finally be worth something by feeding his life into Rey so she could be the galaxy's shining hope.
That is what I find so repellent, that a victim of child abuse should see himself as so worthless the only good thing he could do was save the pure unsullied virginal heroine his family had chosen over him. The fact that he was so willing to do it doesn't seem like a gift of love, but more as a self sacrifice of someone who thought his only value was to be a metaphorical organ donor.
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Post by Saracene on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 2:56 pm

I maybe wouldn’t mash up what you see in the movie with a novelisation and the writer’s personal interpretation of how Ben might have felt in that moment? None of that is verbalised in the movie.
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Post by motherofpearl1 on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 5:50 pm

Movie, novel, whatever....
The whole thing was a complete shambles. Far too many cooks in the kitchen, I suspect.
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Post by DeeBee on Wed 06 Jan 2021, 9:35 pm

@AhsokaTano wrote:Brace yourselves I love you:
Discussions: Tweets/Instagram - Page 17 5edbe110
@AhsokaTano

@AhsokaTano wrote:@Saracene
Good point ! I know Ben Solo fans who aren’t reylos - I was cautious because he said reylo fans . Reylo and Ben Solo fans aren’t the same thing . Yes you can be both though . Strange wording . I am hoping they do something different with Ben as we didn’t see a force ghost . Maybe through the dyad he can return ( as it’s a bond linking them beyond time and space ) or maybe like Gandalf and Neo in the matrix he will return from death in another way . I keep thinking of that quote about Ben solo - “with the blood of a scroundrel and a princess in his veins his defiance will shake the stars “ and how his name literally means “only son” .  Like Neo, Jesus messiah figures and  Loki he is both a prince and a trickster and a magician . He resurrects others before he can himself . I just don’t think we are finished with his story yet . And in the words of kylo when he discovers rey and his force bond dyad “this is something new “. I may be delusional clinging on to hope I know but that’s me . Sigh ! I love you
@AhsokaTano - I just wanted to say thanks for sharing your finds. I am basically counting on people such as yourself to fill me in if anything pops up that would be of interest! Because I'm just not invested in SW enough to keep across news and new releases. So thanks for sharing.
I don't share your hope for the future of SW, however I also think - good on you!!! Cling to hope (as you put it) as much as you like! I wish I was able to maintain some hope at this point. I would never wish to take away anyone's current hopes and joy in SW just because my own have been lost.

Hi all, I've enjoyed reading other's thoughts about this news of new upcoming young Ben Solo content - I can't see a reason why I would be excited about it though. It's going to either:
1) endear Ben Solo's character to me even more than he already is - when I know he is going to eventually die young without real closure.
Or
2) paint Ben Solo's backstory in a negative light, emphasising further the evil deeds of Kylo Ren,  and further fan the flames of hate toward the character.
More young Ben Solo content will either emphasise how he was victimized or how he victimized others.
Given what I've seen from LFL, I predict it will present both - and try to have it both ways, so people can have their own preferred perspective 'confirmed'. And fan 'debate' continues...
But, with either of these takes? I can't see a win here for me in engaging with young Ben Solo content. Either stinks... it's just lots of angst with no HEA. No thanks SW.
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Post by AhsokaTano on Thu 07 Jan 2021, 1:45 pm

@Dee Bee
Thank you I love you I will continue sharing what I find as you never know what will come up


Hey everyone I just found this - either they’ve been reading my Loki theories lol or something odd is afoot . Noah and Corey run kessel run transmissions who have been on the ball with leaks this year ( they used to work with MSW - Noah in particular is a kylo/Ben fan ). So Den of nerds as have said above is working with them now and he’s been hinting all day regarding the Kevin Feige Star Wars film . So this just got posted .
[url=https://servimg.com/view/19863862/1228]Discussions: Tweets/Instagram - Page 17 E76f6710

Kevin feige with Tom Hiddleston ( Loki ). Omg ! .....

Ok am just going to add this too :

https://www.reddit.com/r/StarWarsLeaks/comments/ksi4fh/loki_creator_michael_waldron_tapped_to_write/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf


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Post by AhsokaTano Yesterday at 4:24 am

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( do hope they remove the scar because Rey healed it when he became Ben again )
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Post by unicorn Yesterday at 12:40 pm

I have a dark Rey. Maybe I should buy her a light Ben. Cool
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Post by motherofpearl1 Yesterday at 12:42 pm

You know I would have loved seeing Dark Rey. I suspect Daisy would have liked the opportunity to play her as well.
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Post by californiagirl Yesterday at 2:03 pm

My feed is mostly excited about the Ben Solo funko, even if he looks beat up. Looks like they did the slightly bloodied up Rey too. And here I thought they were done putting out the small amount of TROS merch. They also seem to have realized that Babu Frik was one of the few widely liked things in the move too, I had wondered why most of the merch I saw of him was fanmade. And is this the first piece of official merch with the yellow saber? Took them long enough.
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Post by californiagirl Yesterday at 4:22 pm

Apparently Funko Ben already sold out it's preorder on the US Amazon site. Some site's versions don't have him and Rey looking all beat up either. Seriously, whenever they make a new Kylo/Ben thing, it sells like hotcakes. Glad to know they finally figured that out.
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Post by Lily Snape Yesterday at 11:02 pm

@unicorn wrote:okay, so much ado about nothing, as was to be expected. That´s the reason why I don´t care much anymore.

I don´t get why I should be hyped to see Ben Solo in live action as a boy?
I know the character is already dead in the future and that´s it. Nothing to see here.
Same for the fact that this guy will argue pro Reylo (or whatever) with the fandom menace. Who cares? I clearly not.
@unicorn

I’d care about Ben Solo live action as a boy if it turned out that he had studied Qui Gon Jinn’s theories on immortality in the Force or the World Between Worlds or some other sort of resurrection type thing and it gave us reason to believe that he’d come back to Rey. Other than that, it’s just the sad backstory of a manipulated child who winds up dying as a young man before he ever really gets to live.
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Post by motherofpearl1 Today at 2:46 am

My sentiments exactly. And if that's all they're going to give us I can only wonder why? Do they like rubbing salt in woulnds, or what? I don't think I'll ever forget Abrams saying Ben's fate in TROS was 'pretty fun'. I like to think he meant seeing Kylo turn back into Ben - because if that wasn't it, he has a pretty sick sense of humour.
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